Howdy folks! I have 4 seedling loquats that have been doing wonderful with no supplementation, and would like to add 9 more, wih smaller seed or more flesh, as well as preferably sweeter (kids LOVE the seedling ones, so they are ok). If they bloom in Feb, we are clear most years of hard freezes, so later blooming would work well. I am having trouble getting consistent marketing material from websites, as it’s hard to guage the qualities I’m looking for when the websites just want to sell, so any experience yall have would be greatly appreciated! Wilson orchards currently has Vista white, early red, and gold nugget…
‘Vista White’ is a sort of latish blooming variety.
If you don’t mind grafting cuttings on to seedlings then I suggest that you get scion of ‘Sunset’, and of ‘Viking’. One of those two flowers latish and the other one flowers both early and latish, that way even if the early flowers fall off from the cold, a second batch of flowers pop out. This website sells scion of those varieties Fruit Tree, Plant and Gardening Nursery – AKME Gardens
Yes, but if you read the full paper and the referenced papers, they also talk about how these hybrids from distal Rosaceae species don’t survive. They are inherently genetically unstable. In many cases, the cross pollination attempts don’t even produce any seed. You get seedless fruit, which could be a benefit for consumption, but not if you’re trying to breed loquat hybrids.
In the cases were hybridization seems successful with E. japonica, they were other Eriobotrya species and the progeny still have issues. On top of this, even when they got hybridization within the genus, the fruit dropped shortly. It set, but it didn’t ripen. So crossing within Eriobotrya, they still have problems with getting full embryonic development.
As compared with the gametic incompatibility, distant hybridization incompatibility breaks the stable genetic system during long-term evolution leading to the death of the hybrids. Arrested or incomplete embryo development, deformed embryos that drop, low germination rate, and low seedling growth rate contribute to the survival rate in hybrids. F1 plants die while developing or because of development disorders, have vegetative growth advantage, set few fruits or fruits with abnormal structure making it difficult for future progenies to survive (Li et al., 2001; Zhang and Sun, 2003;Ma et al., 2004;Ma and Chen, 2004; Fu et al., 2005; Chen et al., 2009; Qiet al., 2013).
Hybrids formed from different combinations among E. prinoides, E. japonica, and E. prinoides var. daduhensis are compatible and produce F1. However, these species (male) are incompatible with E. deflexa and its two variants, E. kwangsiensis and E. elliptica (female) producing flowers, which abscise one week after pollination. Pollen germination needs 2 to 5 d to reach the sac for fertilization in Eriobotrya after which it forms fruit(Carrera et al., 2009; Guo et al., 2010). The study corroborates this result wherein incompatibility could be attributed primarily to sporophytic incompatibility.
In addition, hybridization between E. deflexa and its two variants, E. kwangsiensis and E. elliptica resulted in fruit set, but most fruits dropped within two weeks. E. elliptica as a female parent had the highest rate of fruit drop. The seeds from hybrids of E. deflexa and its two variants, and E. kwangsiensis, germinated and grew roots, but the seedlings did not survive for more than 2 months.
All the loquats in Southeast Texas bloom in October and November. Mine are just about to flower. That is the problem with growing them in zones colder than zone 9. You have to carry the fruit through winter without getting temperatures below 28 degrees. I got one from Top Tropicals called Barbie that tasted good, similar to apricot. They are currently on sale, but still $49 plus shipping.
I do not see a problem with mixing multiple pollen from like the sour California Native toyon berry it seems close
)heteromelis arbutifolia
or cotoneaster (photonia (now Aronia Red chock berry looks promising on some of these science web sites)
These would be interesting to have
Eriobotrya elliptica E. hookerriana E. petiolata
Even if something like the hybrid copper tone is not listed as any good
some fruits are not good out of hand , but after mixing with water, and adding sugar the flavor comes out (Example (Mexican) Hawthorn, as well as many “Herbal” tea’s)
I did not want to get side tracked, but remember pick the right pollen parent if one has more chromosones then the other.
(like a Donkey can be Fertile "sometimes) but a Hinny never will be
(or the Horse as a male makes a Hinny, but will be sterile )
So maybe they are using the wrong parents with some if these crosses
(and also as was also brought up by another Member Could try cut style pollenating
or cutting the female flowers tubes smaller like some flower breeders do to make a cross work, and also pollenating twice, but I am no Expert just saw what others do (online) sometimes.)
Cut style pollenating can be hard to find
Here are two sites one is a lily forum
, and one a Scientific Journal (about loquat, and other examples)
(note I would like to explain more about some things I just do not have the time right now
but I think a species of loquat that flowers in spring would be a good start to try with or a native.
https://journals.ashs.org/hortsci/view/journals/hortsci/55/3/article-p287.xml%20
here is where that picture above came from
Example of what I mentioned above Female should have more Chromosone
(also brought up here in Blackberry breeding Topic, and other topics as well.)
From here
https://www2.palomar.edu/users/warmstrong/hybrids1.htm
You really should read the whole paper as I mentioned earlier.
In addition, hybridization between E. deflexa and its two variants, E. kwangsiensis and E. elliptica resulted in fruit set, but most fruits dropped within two weeks.
It’s not just about chromosome count. It’s also about the genetic distance during chromosome reassortment. Just because a science has sorted organisms by taxonomy, that doesn’t mean each species within a genus shares the same genetic distance. Species within a genus can have varying genetic distance. Clade assortment is a way for scientists to group things in the most likely genetic or morphological similar logical way. It doesn’t uniformly sort genetic similarity between species or clades.
As for the female chromosome thing, you’re referring to Haldane’s Rule, when you use hinny as an example. This ONLY applies for species where chromosomes determine sex. Male heterogamety and female heterogamety are possible. Meaning the reverse can also be true depending on species where the male hybrid is fertile vs the female hybrid is fertile. This rule does not apply in monoecious plants. Thus, you can’t apply the Rubus breeding rules to Erioboytra. Each species has it’s own quirks.
Moreover, many modern hybrids especially those in the plant breeding world aren’t just simply the result of crosses. They use modern laboratory techniques like embryo rescue when the seed development is incomplete due to genetic instability. Even the late Jerry Lehman resorted to these techniques (i.e. NB-21 hybrid persimmon) because hybridization between species is (or can be) difficult even when there is close genetic proximity.
3 Likes
My loquat has a decent amount of fruit on it this year…hopefully I’ll be able to get more than a few before the birds and other critters have their way…
3 Likes
