I was just reading on the “other forum” that Maha was one of the best. If you can I would love to hear your evaluations. Pickering sounds very nice too. I recently tried a Golden Glow from Kihei which was excellent - had alot of peach and coconut overtones.
I have a few misc. seeds germinating along with some Cherimoya here. I am really looking foward to trying the various sapotes and Mangosteen (@ Mamuang). In terms of avocados, there is a lace bug that is wrecking havoc in the islands.
Got these from Frank on there, this is probably representative of what he’s putting in the boxes this week.
The two ripe ones I ate before taking that photo were Mahachanok and Po Pyu Kalay (“Lemon Meringue”). They are incredibly different mangos, but both very good. It was my first time trying either one, as far as I know, but I did filch quite a few unknown fallen mangoes from yards when I was a homeless kid in Miami, and I definitely remember some good little skinny ones like these.
The Maha has a much more mangoey taste (I’m not very good at describing mango flavors!) and was extremely sweet. Less tartness than some mangos, that’s the only criticism I can think of. Might have been a day or so overripe, though, but no off flavors yet.
PPK was strongly citrusy with a bit of fiber, but also very tasty and refreshing, no lack of sugars. Was right around peak ripeness I think.
There are only two things you can do to keep it warmer. One heat to about 65 at night or two set the exhaust fan to come on about 10-15F warmer. The later is cheaper since it reduces cost. Heating increases cost. Both would increase humidity a bit.
The truth is that your climate is way too cold for mango and there is only so much that you can do that makes any sense with a greenhouse.
Your climate is much more suitable for growing greenhouse stone fruit than mango. Even my climate which is warmer and sunnier all year long is better suited to stone fruit than mango. Stone fruit eating quality is on par with mango. Buying the mango from FL and growing stone fruit would be better use of your greenhouse.
My goal growing mango is to determine how eating quality of mango compares to stone fruit. It costs about 4x as much heating cost to grow mango vs stone fruit in my greenhouse. IMO stone fruit from my greenhouse is world class eating quality.
My greenhouse is mostly for avocados, which seem to flourish at this temperature range, the sole mango was planted mostly an experiment, after reading about some people successfully growing Ataulfo mangoes outdoors in San Francisco. My greenhouse is similar to SF temperatures, and gets a lot warmer in July and August.
Stone fruit grow outdoors here just fine, other than PLC issues, so I don’t see a need to dedicate greenhouse space to those. They can be bought locally at farmers markets near perfect ripeness. I did plant one peach tree last year, too, and it’s already almost doubled in size this year, might even have some peaches next year.
Even in California I couldn’t find good stone fruit at farmers markets, grocery stores, or fruit stands. It was worse than what I grew outside in Amarillo. I won’t have any confidence in WA stone fruit. The climate isn’t as good as CA. I didn’t grow stone fruit I was really happy with until I learned how to grow it in my greenhouse.
I’ve ordered mango from FL this time of year several times. None came close to my stone fruit. Store bought mango here are usually a disaster. But so are store bought nectarines, peaches, and apricots.
I don’t know if I can grow really top line mango in my greenhouse. None of this is easy in my experience. The difference between good and great is large and elusive.
Most of the stone fruit (peaches, plums, nectarines) at the local farmers market is grown in eastern WA, and the farmers drive their trucks over the mountains to get that premium price in urban farmers markets. I have no doubt that it still is not as good as what you manage in your greenhouse, but they are usually very sweet and ripe by the middle of the season.
If you’re including cherries as stone fruit, they are so good from the local market that I feel no need to even try to grow them, especially with the SWD pressure here.
Cherries are certainly stone fruit and one of the best. Occasionally they are good in the store but mostly a disappointment.
Peaches grown in Eastern WA are far better than those grown here in W.Wa. Growing peaches outdoors in Western WA is a waste of time IMO. I don’t have a greenhouse anymore or I would try growing them inside one.
But even the best E.WA peaches are no comparison to those grown in California’s central valley.
I remember a few years ago at a fig gathering in Oroville, @fruitgrower brought over some of his stone fruit. They were better than any I had ever tasted.
@fruitnut probably has similar climate to Jon in his greenhouse.
Fruitgrower is a very skilled grower. He uses the same deficit irrigation techniques that I use and has the advantage of being outdoors in a climate with adequate but usually not excessive heat.
When I visited DWN near Modesto about 10 years ago I talked to their salesman about deficit irrigation to improve fruit quality. They looked at me like I was a crazed maniac. They’re very much into the commercial fruit growing mold. Including picking the fruit two weeks early for shipment. The fruit at their weekly tasting events wasn’t really eatable. It was rock hard. Which made it difficult to pick out winners and losers. When in their tests orchards I was the guy straying off looking for ripe fruit even if it was an unknown variety next to what they were discussing.
To close out this somewhat off-topic detour, I finished the last mango today from the box. The last two to “ripen” (Honey Kiss and Sweet Tart) were picked too early and did not ripen correctly, so they don’t get to be included in the ranking. Here’s how I rank the rest:
Bringing it closer to the topic of this thread, I’m sad that both the Mahachanok seeds appear to be mono-embryonic:
I thought both PPK were too, but now that they are sprouting the one on the right looks like 2-3 embryos after all (left one is mono though):
Lemon Zest is clearly poly, as is Sweet Tart, which looks to have the most embryos I’ve ever seen in a single mango seed:
Both Guava seeds are also poly, and I didn’t save the others.
I’m getting mango fruit from Frank any day now. I’ll let you know what I think of the fruit after I eat it.
I’m hoping to grow the seeds out as well.
Make sure they ripen enough! It’s easy to eat them even one day early, which can be a world of difference in flavor and texture. Most varieties should be highly fragrant for at least a day or two before they are ready, some take even longer. I find it hard to resist cutting them as soon as they become fragrant, but patience is rewarded.
Thank you, that will help my evaluation. You grew up eating mango. I have little experience. I have heard that over ripe can also be bad. As you mention picking at the right time is also important and can be difficult to judge. Messy, can’t eat without a knife, fiber, big seed, hard to pick and ripen. Not sure why I don’t just stick to stone fruit. Nectarine, apricot, peach, and pluot are pretty easy to pick at a good stage. Most I like just as they start to soften on the tree. Sweet cherries can be a bit more difficult, but hey, try a few and see if they’re ready.
Yes, though it varies from variety to variety. It starts to ferment and produce off flavors within a week usually, and the texture can become very soft or gelatinous too. I honestly used to like them best fully tree ripe (dropped or at least already fragrant and easy to identify), even if they started to ferment, but the development of off-flavors during that period varies widely from variety to variety, and from location to location (i.e. direct sun causes more off flavors during tree ripening).
I also usually would just peel and eat sorta like a banana until you have clean seed tip to grab and hold the other way, and then like a popsicle. Overripe ones you can eat by just biting or cutting the tip and then squeezing the flesh out of that hole into your mouth. That method will help you learn if you are sensitive to the sap!
I should add that if they start to wrinkle without becoming fragrant first, they were picked too soon. There could be varieties that never become fragrant when ripe, but I’ve never had one that I recall.
Thank you again. That helps a lot.
I got mango in about 5 days ago from Frank in FL. They arrived in excellent condition. Pickering was nearly ripe on arrival and very fragrant. I’ve eaten those and the Maha Chanok. Both were OK not great. About as good as a decent cantalope which is third tier fruit to me at best.
I tried one Lemon Zest which is very highly regarded. It was barely eatable. Now I’m afraid to try anything else for fear it may not be ripe. They’ve turned yellow and have a bit of fragrance.
Should I try them or wait? @swincher
Pictured as received and now about 5 days later.
If they feel soft when gently squeezed (like a ripe peach) and are fragrant, they should be ripe. If they still feel firm, let them go another couple days. Unfortunately, color change is a bad indicator until you know a particular variety well enough to understand what the color break signifies. Some varieties stay deep green until rotten, others start to change color long before they should even be picked, while some do indeed change right as they reach peak ripeness.
I’m sad to hear you’re not impressed with them so far. I would rate a properly tree ripened mango above any fruit I’ve eaten, period. I’d say a third of the fruit in my box were near that perfect ripeness, about a third were clearly picked too early (but I had pressured him to include a couple of those varieties, so that’s on me), the remaining third were close enough to being ripe that I still liked them better than any cantaloupe I’ve ever had, better than most stone fruit.
Let a few get overripe so you will understand what that is like. Strongly fragrant and very soft. They may taste a little fermented at that point, but it sounds to me like you’re mostly eating them early so I’d try the other end of the spectrum to help find the middle.
I’ll hold off but don’t have much hope. They are more yellow now than they appear in the second picture. They’ve all changed a lot in color since arriving.
I heard a lot of disease ( fungal mainly) that infect the mangoes. I think all depend on the area people live and choosing right variety for the region.
