Does anyone grow native persimmons and keep them pruned short? And still get fruit? I would prefer not to have 60 ft tall trees. My experience with trees out in the wild is, when they get ripe, they fall, bounce off a few branches on their way down, and then land in the grass/dirt. They’re damaged and dirty by the time i get to them. Not very appetizing.
I was recommended the JT-02 persimmon on here because it will stay small at 20 feet, is super cold hardy (some report down to -16 but others on here have reported it living to -30 after a few years of frost) and they are seedless fruit. That being said good luck getting your hands on one. It took me 2 years to get my hands on one because they sell out so fast.
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I’m trialing keeping a few shorter by pruning them to an open vase form like stone fruit. Those trees are still smaller, but I have high hopes for them.
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I have a tree that was sold to me as Prok. It’s been in the ground since 2015. With hard annual pruning – severe heading cuts – I’ve kept it <25’. Nevertheless, it fruits heavily. In full disclosure, I have top-worked 80% of it to other varieties. But the shoots emerging from what’s left of the central leader produce plenty of fruit. I have no doubt that you could keep a tree short by creating a low head, encouraging spreading scaffolds, and suppressing / removing any vertical growth.
Yes, this is basically the strategy suggested by @Ahouse422. Persimmons are more resistant to an open vase form than peaches; it seems that they will persist it throwing off lots of vertical shoots. I think we just have to be persistent in removing them.
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Like Ahouse if you first prune to an open vase, but also start the first year after you have four to five main scaffolds tieing their annual growth down with a training pole tied to each scaffold where they emanate from the tree trunk, you can pull the training pole back down to slightly above horizontal and stake it down. Then as the scaffolds grow about each foot of growth you tie them back to the training pole.
I think this would reduce the amount of pruning work but give you producing scaffold and lateral limbs off each scaffold that can produce fruit within normal reach. I trained my IE mulberry to an umbrella shape, and that is a variety that love to go vertical, so it’s a matter of determination.
Good luck and good training
Dennis
Kent, wa
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I agree with this approach. Just be warned that vertical shoots will appear. These must be removed. FWIW, I routinely remove all shoots originating on the top 1/4 (or bottom 1/4) of a scaffold. The surviving shoots come out the sides.
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Thanks everyone. I will give it a try.
Make a lot of sense!
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FWIW I was just visiting a local CRFG chapter acquaintance’s garden the other day and he showed me his Imoto Fuyu Persimmon that he keeps at about 7 ft tall and heavily pruned. He said he gets an LOT of fruit from it each year. It was probably about 6 ft wide.
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@SoCalBackyard – Good info. But note that the Imoto Fuyu species is Asian persimmon (D. Kaki) whereas the question is about native American persimmon (D. Virginiana), which grows MUCH larger.
To exemplify the difference: I’ve been able to keep three Ichi Ki Kei Jiro (Kaki) at ~15’ with modest annual pruning. Meanwhile, I’ve struggled to keep Prok (Virginiana) at ~20’ – it’s an annual chain saw massacre. All these trees we’re planted in 2015.
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In my climate, the American are quite dwarfed and barely grow 1 ft a year if I’m lucky. Hybrids and Japanese seem to have more vigor.
All on DV. Most were purchased as trees from Englands.
Hi Dean
I hope this helps:
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Makes sense. I didn’t see that distinction. Good to know that these 2 types are so different in vigor and my apologies for any confusion. Given what you are saying, I don’t think I have the space for a Prok at this time. Maybe one day if/when we buy our “orchard land” 
…
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When you do, there are better DV varieties than Prok, IMO. I’d be happy to give you my 2 cents when the time comes, but there’s plenty of info on the forum.
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Excellent article thanks! Glad to read this.
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If its ok now what American varieties are better than prok and why? Thanks
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There is an old USDA bulletin IIRC about american persimmon, which mentions among other thongs that there are two different “forms” of the species- one an upright grower and the other a broad shrub. Its unclear to what extent this is accurate, and if so, it’s unclear to what extent that form is conferred by rootstock to its grafted variety. I have two ‘Prok’ trees, and they have markedly different forms. One is far more vigorous, the other shorter and more spreading. They are growing in different areas, so that might explain the difference in part or in full. There are also definitely dwarfish cultivars that grow relatively little regardless of rootstock effects. Szukis is the one Im most familiar with. I have 2 Szukis trees and both are about 8’ tall at ~ 10 yrs old. Their form is not only NOT vertical, they actually tend to grow DOWNWARD, even without fruit to load down the limbs.
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Notice what Cliff says about Zima Khurma hybrid…
Zima khurma =NB-02 Persimmon bred out of Nikitskaya Bordovaya, cold hardy and good producer of orange medium to large size fruit that ripens Late-season on a semi-vigorous tree. Has low spreading growth habit and is a beautiful specimen in the fall. Trees are very cold hardy tested down to minus -16.4 F for a long time. This cultivar was bred in Japan and brought to America by Jerry Lehman of Terre Haute, Indiana. Zone 5b to ZONE 8, tested to -16 F.
“Low spreading growth habit”.
I grafted ZK to a wild dv last spring. 6 other varieties grafted last spring all established a central leader that grew quite tall… but not ZK.
It stayed low and spreading…
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