My hybrid Honan Red X Rossy male has been ripening in the protection of my screened-in porch, since the animals are stealing even unripe astringent fruit from my other trees. I got it about 2 years ago from Dax who grafted it with scion wood from Cliff. I have kept it in a 5-gallon pot while deciding if it is worth planting out in one of my few remaining spots.
Now that they are ripening the fruit looks very close to the Honan Red parent and I was a little worried a mistake was made and it was actually not the hybrid, but I think it must be the hybrid since there were seeds in the fruit and the only pollen around would be from wild males that also pollinate my American persimmons. The seeds werenāt fully formed, but there has been 2 in the first fruit I ate and 1 in the second so it is consistent so far.
Very rich tasting, not too soft and watery when ripe and quite sweet. Mostly kaki flavored, but I think there is more richness than any astringent kaki Iāve had.
It was excellent. I was going to decide whether to plant this one or Sestronka, but I havenāt gotten any fruit from Sestronka yet and this one is so good and productive that I may just give it the spot they were competing for.
Iām also really impressed with the production and how well this small tree held its fruit, especially compared to Nikita! My only issue has been a fair bit of the mouse ear issue on the leaves (I think it needs nickel), but I expect that is the limits of the potting soil and it would be fine in ground.
I think Cliff had several trees of that cross in his orchard and I do remember that one of them may have gotten a name.
The cross was all the information I had from Dax, except that he said Cliff said it was one of the best tasting hybrids, so I donāt really know for sure if one was named and if that is actually the one I have. I donāt have a way to reach Dax, but if you connect with him it would be great to know. Tell him his babies are doing well in Arlington, VA.
New to persimmons. What is the main flavor / texture difference between Diospyros virginiana and Diospyros kaki (assuming both are soft when ripe / astringent varieties)?
I sampled some at Ron Powellās orchard recently (zone 6b) and generally found the varieties I tried (Prok, JCEG, H63a, etc.) to be extremely similar in terms of flavor and not to my liking. However, there was one young tree (unknown variety) that tasted AMAZING totally different flavor and texture. The fruit was literally dripping wet and had a jelly type consistency and more interesting flavor. The seeds were also slimmer and longer.
Iām wondering if this was maybe a hybrid variety? The leaves werenāt super shiny like most kakis, but the flavor and texture was like eating a completely different fruit. Worth noting that this tree was also much younger / smaller than the others I tried fruit from.
Taste was very good. Texture was firmer than any American Iāve had, even Prok. Zero astringency. Faint hints of butterscotch. Sweet, and plenty rich enough. Not watery. Definitely could taste the Asian in it. Interestingly it was more seeded than any of my Americans were this year. Seeds were taller and slimmer than any American seeds. I only have native males a ways off in the woods to pollinate.
Iām really looking forward to see if the rest hold up as well as this first one. We have had less than an inch of rain over the last two months. Yesterday we got a few inches and thereās several days of rain coming up in the next week. I hope that it doesnāt dilute the flavor.
According to my notes, David Lavergneās Honan Red x F2 Rosseyanka male is named Russian Red. I suppose there could be another seedling from this cross.
Edit: Seeing Zendogās comment below, I checked quickly. Cliff reports having a bunch of seedlings from crosses of Honan Red x Rosseyanka. So David Lavergneās cross would seem to be merely the first named cross.
I just heard from Cliff that it is actually the hybrid named Cardinal, not to be confused with the non astringent SMC is growing. He also said it has survived at his place since 2012, so it has seen some reasonably low temps and pulled through. There was some twig damage in 2014 back to pencil-size wood when the lows hit -16.
I have sprouted seeds from Coffee Cake (Nishamura Wase) just to see if they were viable and had all of them sprout. I didnāt bother growing them out though.
I have several 90c american and hybrid varieties grafted hereā¦
Since I am in southern TNā¦ all the wild persimmons around here (and I have quite a few 60c males around). But all of my wild native dv should be 60c.
All these american and hybrids I have added should be 90c.
I was hoping for mostly seedless fruit.
Our wild females that fruit here normally have 5-7 seeds.
Having mostly seedless fruit would be so nice.
Do you think the wild males that you have at your place are northern males 90c ?
I may find out next season how that will work hereā¦ still hoping for seedless fruit.
Missouri is supposedly 90 chromosome territory. That is from a journal online and an oversimplified map on research gate. So I expected seeds, and I donāt mind them, so thatās OK. Hopefully youāll get seedless fruit if thatās your preference.
