Seems like you could secure it to a stake in a few different spots and straighten it out over time.
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Since you already have a cage around it, it will be easy to straighten with either a pole through the cage or with ties / tape. Iād do that. You want roots to have plenty of development in the first year, and more leaves = more energy = more root growth.
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Hereās how I do it (using a just-planted baby chestnut as an example).
Before:
After:
You can add more stakes / strings as necessary if there are more bends in the main stem that you want to straighten. Takes literally seconds. This method also gives the tree a little more freedom of movement than tying it directly to a stake, allowing it to sway some in the wind. This lets the trunk stiffen faster.
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Most of you knowā¦ I grafted several varieties of persimmons last springā¦ Americans and hybridsā¦ to my wild DV rootstock and got some awesome first year growthā¦
JT02 shoot grew 10 ft.
Prok had leaves12 inches long.
This is year 2 for those and the growth is looking awesome again.
JT02, Prok, Kasandra, Nakittaās gift, WS8-10 are all sporting some nice blossoms already.
What is the norm for a persimmon actually producing fruit in a situation like this ?
Year 2 3 4 ?
Thanks
TNHunter
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Several of my kakis produced at least some fruit on year 2. Nikitaās Gift made a lot of flowers on year 3, but it is notorious for not carrying fruit to term until it is older.
Prok is blossoming for the first time on Year 4. Yates is getting big on Year 3, but has not blossomed.
Given that you grafted on established roots, Iād guess that you have a good shot at getting fruit this year from your flowering trees.
I have lost a lot of kaki this year ā many of which were heavily laden with blossoms, some for the first time ā to what appears to be Kaki SDS (sudden death syndrome). SDS apparently affects kaki and kaki hybrids in the South and may be due to a pathogen that is killed by colder winters further north, but is endemic to the Southeast. Pure Americans are immune to whatever it is.
I hope you donāt get SDS in Tennessee. My kakis were among my favorites in my orchard ā such naturally beautiful and productive trees ā and I wasnāt anticipating them getting the scythe in this way. Iām thinking of planting JT-02 on the hope that its mostly American heritage will make it immune.
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Wow, thatās crazy impressive growth. More like a pear than a persimmon.
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@marten ā¦
Unofficial world record persimmon shoot growthā¦ from the bud on the scion to the tip 10 ft.
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In the 2nd season after grafting to a large DV tree, three Americans (BB/WS8-10, H63A, D-128) and one hybrid (JT-02) all fruited very well. One Asian (Miss Kim) did not. The same three Americans and one hybrid did not fruit in the second season after grafting to small DV seedlings. Based on this small sample, Iād say that the maturity of the rootstock is critical.
Note that the same scions were used in both sets of grafts. So for example, the one sample of JT-02 scions were used for both the mature DV tree and the young DV seedling. These grafts were performed in the same season. All the grafts grew in the same location, within 30 yards of each other. So the maturity of the rootstock is the only real variable.
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That is very clever and I appreciate you showing me. I was not envisioning doing it that way, but I always worry about what you note, the benefit of the wind, so this will be very helpful.
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Iām in envy of 10ā of growth, because my JT-02 , in Ky., only had 6 āof growth. But lets AI this! (Iām sorry. I wish I wasnāt this way. 
)
I donāt have experience here, but I understand JT-02 doesnāt drop their fruit, but must be sniped off at the desired time. So shouldnāt we pinch off the growth tip at 6ā, to force lateral branching? or where? My ladder is only 6ā. Just wondering.
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@Jobe ā¦ late winterā¦ I whacked it back to 6 ftā¦ collected and traded some nice scionwood.
Early springā¦ notched buds for scaffold branches.
This is what it looked like a week or two ago.
Last year when it hit 6 ft tall early summer and was still growing like crazyā¦ i should have tipped it and let it put all that extra growth into some scaffold development.
I have grafted a few more this yearā¦ H63A H118 Mohler, Journey, Dar Sofiyivky, Saijoā¦
If they grow like thatā¦ will try that this year.
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A little 3 foot tall Gora Goverla appears to be extremely precocious. This was purchased from Dax in Fall of 2021, spent 2022 somewhat neglected in a pot and was planted spring 2023. Since this is one of the largest fruiting hybrids I think even one fruit might bend it to the ground.
So I think Iām going to snip all these buds off, at great pain to myself. Hopefully with some fertilizer it will be strong enough to hold a fruit or 2 next year. I believe it is supposed to be a relatively small tree overall.
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Is this thread meant only for 2024 growing updates, or for all things persimmon 2024? I have a few persimmon specific growing questions - not sure if I should throw them in this thread or start another? There are so many already! lmkā¦
Long story short, I put 25 virginiana bare root seedlings in the ground last spring, and soon Iāll be planting 14 more bare root trees. Additionally, Iāll soon be attempting to graft ~14 of them to various American or hybrid cultivars.
The discussions Iād like to get into:
-
Grafting. Particularly wondering if anyone has attempted grafting onto a freshly-planted bare root tree as it breaks dormancy. Some of my new bare root trees are 30+" tall with nice sized trunks, but Iām concerned grafting them would place too much stress on the trees as they establish. Thoughts?
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Tree size/height tendencies of various cultivars. Iāve gleaned lots of information about the various cultivars reading the numerous excellent threads here. One thing that I havenāt found much detail on is tree stature. This affects my decisions of where to plant/graft each cultivar. I wouldnāt want to locate a tall growing American to the South side of say, JT-02, as it could cast a lot of shade on JT-02. It also affects future decisions around pruning: If a particular cultivar tends to hold onto its fruit instead of dropping when ripe, then Iāll be forced to maintain it to a reachable height. However, if fruit drops when ripe, I think Iād prefer to just let them go as tall as they want to save the effort of annual pruning. The idea would be to locate all of the trees that I intend to let grow tall on the North portion of my planting. Of course, Iād have to have an idea which cultivars possess which stature and drop characteristics in order to make these decisions. Perhaps this is too challenging of a question due to the variability of site/soil and zone specific differences preventing unified conclusions about these particular characteristics?
Cultivars Iāll be grafting this year:
Yates
Prok
Hershey Fruit Dump
DEC Goliath
Mackenzie Corner (Possibly is Early Golden)
JT-02
Kassandra
Possible cultivars to graft next year:
H63A
100-46
Dar Sofiyivky
TBD others
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Hi all,
I crossed Tam Kam nonastringent Kaki with Chocolate PVNA Kaki 2 years ago. I let it grow in a pot for the first year. I planted it in ground last July and it survived the -18F unprotected this January. So I may have the hardiest Kaki out there.
Tony
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You can absolutely graft to newly transplanted rootstocks. I habitually graft to roots at time of planting (potted up to grow out). Of course, your first year growth results (and maybe over the first few years) will be better if you let them establish for a year. That being said, if you have scion in hand now, why waste it?
Generally speaking, my understanding is that most pure virginiana cultivars will grow 20-30ā tall with light pruning or if left to their own devices, with an upright habit. Most hybrids will be smaller than that with a more open habit. That will vary from cultivar to cultivar. For example, JT-02 and Dar Sofiyivki are supposed to be in the 10-15ā range, and Chuchupaka will be more like 15-20ā. YMMV. All hybrids that Iām aware of will not drop their fruit. Most (if not all) pure virgniana will drop when soft ripe, though some varieties will hold on to more than others.
Lastly, you can control the height through thoughtful pruning. Iām hoping to maintain my virginiana tree at 15-20ā, but weāll see what happens.
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Very cool! I hope it keeps up, and I hope itās a female!
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Wow!! That is super and best of luck from here on out!
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That is excellent! A potentially 5a kaki. Always wondered if there might not be genetics like that on Hokkaido, or in Heilongjiang. Looks like you discovered some in Omaha!
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RE your point #1: In recent years I have dug three root spouts from a neighborās native persimmon tree and moved them to a better spot. That was around Nov-dec. Then grafted over to kaki a few months later after they leaded out. These root sprouts had VERY FEW fine roots. Two of three survived and put on some decent growth. Seems like they are pretty tough and graft easy. I used a cleft graft.
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