@don1357 Is Franklin Cider any good as an eating apple?
2 Likes
Nope, it is a certifiable spitter. It is a bitter sharp with so much acid and tannins that you can’t even taste the also huge amount of sugars it has.
But for juice? It can turn table apples cider from mediocre to awesome.
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Check out these varieties from Gnarly Pippins: Varieties – Gnarly Pippins
These are mostly wild apples of “superior qualities of flavor and growth/hardiness to the various diseases and disorders which can befall the venerable pome”. Several varieties are crabs or crab-like and may fit your bill. On the bottom of the page is the link for the shop, and scions are on sale now. Get some before they’re gone. I’ve grafted several varieties to test in my own orchard, still too soon to get any fruit however.
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I was wondering if anyone was growing some of the gnarly pips on here. Matt is an inspiration and I’ve got several of his finds in my collection. What varieties do you have, and where are you based out of? Looking forward to when all sorts of people have actively fruiting gnarly pips, it’s still early days!
Thanks for that Gnarly Pippins page, I hadn’t seen those. I assume you also have some of the Redbyrd seedlings:
I have fruited Gnarled Chapman and it is indeed a true bittersweet. It is not very productive so far but otherwise looks to be really good for cider. Bigger than a golf ball though.
I have a late crab I call Wickson’s Son, it is like Wickson but smaller, later, and with more tannins. I got it labeled Chestnut so either it was the rootstock of a once-Chestnut tree or a mislabeled different crab. Smaller than a golf ball for sure.
1 Like
Cool, yeah I’m excited to see what comes of these. I am in Albuquerque, NM, so quite a different environment than where they came from. I have Old Fertile, Thornton Brass, Trousers Pear and Ed’s Winter. I think I can squeeze in a couple more in my space, still deciding which. So far they are growing fine for me, just as good as any other apples I’ve grafted in the last two years.
Flowering times of apples RHS Pollination Groups To ensure good pollination and therefore a good crop, it is essential to grow two or more different cultivars from the same Flowering Group or adjacent Flowering Groups. Some cultivars are triploid – they have sterile pollen and need two other cultivars for good pollination; therefore, always grow at least two other nontriploid cultivars with each one.
Key
AGM = RHS Award of Garden Merit
-
Incompatible with each other
** Incompatible with each other
*** ‘Golden Delicious’ may be ineffective on ‘Crispin’ (syn. ‘Mutsu’)
Flowering Group 1 Very early; pollinated by groups 1 & 2
‘Gravenstein’ (triploid)
‘Lord Suffield’
‘Manks Codlin’
‘Red Astrachan’
‘Stark Earliest’ (syn. ‘Scarlet Pimpernel’)
‘Vista Bella’Flowering Group 2 Pollinated by groups 1,2 & 3
‘Adams’s Pearmain’
‘Alkmene’ AGM (syn. ‘Early Windsor’)
‘Baker’s Delicious’
‘Beauty of Bath’ (partial tip bearer)
‘Beauty of Blackmoor’
‘Ben’s Red’
‘Bismarck’
‘Bolero’ (syn. ‘Tuscan’)
‘Cheddar Cross’
‘Christmas Pearmain’
‘Devonshire Quarrenden’
‘Egremont Russet’ AGM
‘George Cave’ (tip bearer)
‘George Neal’ AGM
‘Golden Spire’
‘Idared’ AGM
‘Irish Peach’ (tip bearer)
‘Kerry Pippin’
‘Keswick Codling’
‘Laxton’s Early Crimson’
‘Lord Lambourne’ AGM (partial tip bearer)
‘Maidstone Favourite’
‘Margil’
‘Mclntosh’
‘Red Melba’
‘Merton Charm’
‘Michaelmas Red’
‘Norfolk Beauty’
‘Owen Thomas’
‘Reverend W. Wilks’
‘Ribston Pippin’ AGM (triploid, partial tip bearer)
‘Ross Nonpareil’
‘Saint Edmund’s Pippin’ AGM (partial tip bearer)
‘Striped Beefing’
‘Warner’s King’ AGM (triploid)
‘Washington’ (triploid)
‘White Transparent’
Flowering Group 3 Pollinated by groups 2, 3 & 4
‘Acme’
‘Alexander’ (syn. ‘Emperor Alexander’)
‘Allington Pippin’
‘Arthur Turner’ AGM
‘Barnack Orange’
‘Baumann’s Reinette’
‘Belle de Boskoop’ AGM (triploid)
‘Belle de Pontoise’
‘Blenheim Orange’ AGM (triploid, partial tip bearer)
‘Bountiful’
‘Bowden’s Seedling’
‘Bramley’s Seedling’ AGM (triploid, partial tip bearer)
‘Brownlees Russett’
‘Charles Ross’ AGM
‘Cox’s Orange Pippin’ /*
‘Crispin’ (syn. ‘Mutsu’) (triploid) ***
‘Delbarestivale’ AGM (syn. ‘Delcorf’)
‘Discovery’ AGM
‘Duchess’s Favourite’
‘Elstar’ AGM
‘Emneth Early’ AGM (syn. ‘Early Victoria’)
‘Epicure’ AGM (syn. ‘Laxton’s Epicure’) (partial tip bearer)
‘Exeter Cross’
‘Exquisite’
‘Falstaff’ AGM
‘Feltham Beauty’
‘Fiesta’ AGM
‘Fortune’ AGM (syn. ‘Laxton’s Epicure’)
‘Gavin’
‘Granny Smith’
‘Greensleeves’ AGM
‘Grenadier’ AGM
‘Hambling’s Seedling’
‘Holstein’ (triploid) **
‘Hormead Pearmain’
‘James Grieve’ AGM
‘Jerseymac’
‘John Standish’
‘Jonagold’ AGM
‘Jonagold’ AGM (triploid)
‘Jonathan’
‘Jupiter’ AGM (triploid)
‘Karmijn de Sonnaville’ (triploid)
‘Katy’ (syn. ‘Katja’)
‘Kidd’s Orange Red’ AGM *
‘King of Tompkins County’ (triploid)
‘King Russett’ AGM
‘Lane’s Prince Albert ‘AGM
‘Langley Pippin’ (partial tip bearer)
‘Loddington’ (syn. ‘Stone’s’)
‘Lord Grosvenor’
‘Lord Hindlip’
‘Malling Kent’
‘Mère de Ménage’
‘Merton Knave’
‘Merton Prolific’
‘Merton Russet’
‘Merton Worcester’ (partial tip bearer)
‘Miller’s Seedling’
‘Mutsu’ (syn. ‘Crispin’) (Triploid) ***
‘New Hawthornden’
‘Norfolk Royal Russet’
‘Ontario’
‘Peasgood’s Nonsuch’ AGM
‘Pinova’
‘Polka’ (syn. ‘Trajan’)
‘Queen’
‘Red Devil’
‘Red Victoria’
‘Redsleeves’
‘Reinette du Canada’ (triploid)
‘Rival’
‘Rosemary Russet’ AGM
‘Rubinette’
‘Saint Cecilia’
‘Saint Everard’
‘Saturn’
‘Scotch Dumpling’
‘Scrumptious’
‘Spartan’
‘Stirling Castle’
‘Sturmer Pippin’
‘S.T. Wright’
‘Sunset’ AGM
‘Taunton Cross’
‘Tom Putt’
‘Tydeman’s Early Worcester’ (tip bearer)
‘Wagener’
‘Waltz’ (syn. ‘Telamon’)
‘Wealthy’
‘Winter Gem’
‘Worcester Pearmain’ AGM (tip bearer)
‘Wyken Pippin’
’
Flowering Group 4 Pollinated by groups 3, 4 & 5
‘Annie Elizabeth’
‘Ashmead’s Kernel’ AGM
‘Autumn Pearmain’
‘Barnack Beauty’
‘Cellini’
‘Chivers Delight’
‘Claygate Pearmain’ AGM
‘Cornish Aromatic’
‘Cornish Gillyflower’ (tip bearer)
‘Cox’s Pomona’
‘D’Arcy Spice’
‘Delicious’
‘Duke of Devonshire’
‘Dumelow’s Seedling’ AGM (syn. ‘Dummellor’s Seedling’ & ‘Wellington’)
‘Ellison’s Orange’ AGM
‘Encore’
‘Gala’
‘George Carpenter’
‘Gladstone’ (tip-bearer)
‘Gloster ‘69’
‘Golden Delicious’ AGM ***
‘Golden Noble’ AGM
‘Hawthornden’
‘Herring’s Pippin’
‘Howgate Wonder’
‘Ingrid Marie’
‘Jester’
‘Joybells’
‘King’s Acre Pippin’
‘Lady Henniker’
‘Lady Sudeley’ (tip bearer)
‘Laxton’s Superb’
‘Laxton’s Pearmain’
‘Lord Burghley’
‘Lord Derby’
‘Mannington’s Pearmain’
‘Merton Joy’
‘Monarch’
‘Orleans Reinette’
‘Pixie’
‘Sir John Thornycroft’
‘Tydeman’s Late Orange’
‘Winston’ AGM
‘WooIbrook Russet’
‘Yellow Newtown Pippin’ (syn. ‘Newtown Pippin’)
Flowering Group 5 Pollinated by groups 4, 5 & 6
‘Coronation’
‘Frogmore Prolific’
‘Gascoyne’s Scarlet’ (triploid)
‘Heusgen’s Golden Reinette’
‘King of the Pippins’ AGM
‘Merton Beauty’
‘Mother’ AGM (syn. ‘American Mother’)
‘Newton Wonder’
‘Northern Spy’
‘Reinette Rouge Etoilée’
‘Royal Jubilee’
‘Suntan’ AGM (triploid) **
‘William Crump’
‘Woolbrook Pippin’
Flowering Group 6 Pollinated by groups 5,6 & 7
‘Bess Pool’
‘Court Pendu Plat’
‘Edward VII’ AGM
‘Laxton’s Royalty’
Flowering Group 7
Very late; pollinated by group 6
‘Crawley Beauty’
The following combinations are incompatible:
‘Cox’s Orange Pippin’ pollinated by ‘Kidd’s Orange Red’ and the reverse.
‘Cox’s Orange Pippin’ is ineffective on ‘Holstein’ and ‘Suntan’, and the reverse.
Golden Delicious may be ineffective on ‘Crispin’ (‘Mutau’).
Royal Raindrops crabapple best fall color
Malus ‘JFS-KW5’ (P.P.No. 14,375) ROYAL RAINDROPS® CRABAPPLE
Zone: 4 Height: 20 ft. Width: 15 ft. Fruit: ¼"
Upright, spreading crabapple with purple cutleaf foliage and orange-red fall color. Bright pinkish-red flowers and small persistent red fruit. Excellent disease resistance.
Brandywine good fall color
Purple Prince good fall color
Hocking Hills orchard-makes own crosses.
GMAL 3563(Kazakhstan) Wild PI 600458 x M. sieversii (Open-Pollinated) cross. Large, ribbed bright crimson skin. Flavor acidic-sweet with pleasant aroma, white flesh with pink inside which is different than most.
GMAL 3781(Kazakhstan) GMAL 3781 x M. sieversii (Open-Pollinated) cross. Medium greenish yellow apple with light pink flesh.
PI 613969(Kazakhstan) Red flesh apple.
PI 629318(Kazakhstan) Red flesh apple.
PI 629319(Kazakhstan) Red flesh apple.
PI 633918(Kazakhstan) Red flesh apple.
PK.14(Tamboz, Russian Federation) Medium size fruit with red skin. Red flesh on the outside, white on the inside.
Best Apples For Dehydrating
- Fuji
- Gala
- Gravenstein
- Granny Smith
- Honeycrisp or Honey Crisp
- Cortland
- Empire
- Goldrush
- Zester
- Pink Lady
- Golden Delicious
- Northern Spy
- Winesap
- Red Delicious
- McIntosh
- Macoun
- Spartan
- Braeburn
- Prairie Sensation
- Prairie Sun
Best uncommon storage apples
Abram
Allum
Arkansas Black
Bald Mountain
Baldwin
Belle de Boskoop
Bentley’s Sweet
Blacktwig
Blushing Golden
Braeburn
Brock
Bryson’s Seedling Cannon Pearmain
Chesney
Chieftain
Chiver’s Delight
Clearwater Gold
Cortland
Cox’s Orange Pippin
Crispin
Criterion
Deaderick
Dixie Red Delight
Domine
Egremont Russet
Empire
Enterprise
Erwin Baur
Gloria Mundi
Gold Rush
Golden Russet
Golden Supreme
Grimes
Holstein Cox
Honey Crisp
Hudson’s Golden Gem
Jonafree
Jonalicious
Jonathan
Kidds Orange Red
King
Liberty
Melrose
Mutsu
Newton
Northern Spy
Northwestern Greening
Oxheart Pippin
Pitmaston Pineapple
Prairie Spy
Priscilla
Red Pippin
Sir Prize
Spartan
Spigold
Spitzenburg
Splendour
Stayman
Stayman-Winesap
Stellar
Suncrisp
Sundance
Turley
Virginia Gold
Winesap (turley, stayman)
Winter Banana
Yates
I did a work up and spread sheet also-I work in word perfect but that pup is VERY long-I was picking up rare and heritage information prior to planting. I tried to up load but it wouldn’t work. Here are a few lines of the chart-name, source, description, flowering time and description I pulled off lots of sources.
Flowering times of apples RHS Pollination Groups To ensure good pollination and therefore a good crop, it is essential to grow two or more different cultivars from the same Flowering Group or adjacent Flowering Groups. Some cultivars are triploid – they have sterile pollen and need two other cultivars for good pollination; therefore, always grow at least two other nontriploid cultivars with each one.
Key
AGM = RHS Award of Garden Merit
-
Incompatible with each other
** Incompatible with each other
*** ‘Golden Delicious’ may be ineffective on ‘Crispin’ (syn. ‘Mutsu’)
Flowering Group 1 Very early; pollinated by groups 1 & 2
‘Gravenstein’ (triploid)
‘Lord Suffield’
‘Manks Codlin’
‘Red Astrachan’
‘Stark Earliest’ (syn. ‘Scarlet Pimpernel’)
‘Vista Bella’Flowering Group 2 Pollinated by groups 1,2 & 3
‘Adams’s Pearmain’
‘Alkmene’ AGM (syn. ‘Early Windsor’)
‘Baker’s Delicious’
‘Beauty of Bath’ (partial tip bearer)
‘Beauty of Blackmoor’
‘Ben’s Red’
‘Bismarck’
‘Bolero’ (syn. ‘Tuscan’)
‘Cheddar Cross’
‘Christmas Pearmain’
‘Devonshire Quarrenden’
‘Egremont Russet’ AGM
‘George Cave’ (tip bearer)
‘George Neal’ AGM
‘Golden Spire’
‘Idared’ AGM
‘Irish Peach’ (tip bearer)
‘Kerry Pippin’
‘Keswick Codling’
‘Laxton’s Early Crimson’
‘Lord Lambourne’ AGM (partial tip bearer)
‘Maidstone Favourite’
‘Margil’
‘Mclntosh’
‘Red Melba’
‘Merton Charm’
‘Michaelmas Red’
‘Norfolk Beauty’
‘Owen Thomas’
‘Reverend W. Wilks’
‘Ribston Pippin’ AGM (triploid, partial tip bearer)
‘Ross Nonpareil’
‘Saint Edmund’s Pippin’ AGM (partial tip bearer)
‘Striped Beefing’
‘Warner’s King’ AGM (triploid)
‘Washington’ (triploid)
‘White Transparent’
Flowering Group 3 Pollinated by groups 2, 3 & 4
‘Acme’
‘Alexander’ (syn. ‘Emperor Alexander’)
‘Allington Pippin’
‘Arthur Turner’ AGM
‘Barnack Orange’
‘Baumann’s Reinette’
‘Belle de Boskoop’ AGM (triploid)
‘Belle de Pontoise’
‘Blenheim Orange’ AGM (triploid, partial tip bearer)
‘Bountiful’
‘Bowden’s Seedling’
‘Bramley’s Seedling’ AGM (triploid, partial tip bearer)
‘Brownlees Russett’
‘Charles Ross’ AGM
‘Cox’s Orange Pippin’ /*
‘Crispin’ (syn. ‘Mutsu’) (triploid) ***
‘Delbarestivale’ AGM (syn. ‘Delcorf’)
‘Discovery’ AGM
‘Duchess’s Favourite’
‘Elstar’ AGM
‘Emneth Early’ AGM (syn. ‘Early Victoria’)
‘Epicure’ AGM (syn. ‘Laxton’s Epicure’) (partial tip bearer)
‘Exeter Cross’
‘Exquisite’
‘Falstaff’ AGM
‘Feltham Beauty’
‘Fiesta’ AGM
‘Fortune’ AGM (syn. ‘Laxton’s Epicure’)
‘Gavin’
‘Granny Smith’
‘Greensleeves’ AGM
‘Grenadier’ AGM
‘Hambling’s Seedling’
‘Holstein’ (triploid) **
‘Hormead Pearmain’
‘James Grieve’ AGM
‘Jerseymac’
‘John Standish’
‘Jonagold’ AGM
‘Jonagold’ AGM (triploid)
‘Jonathan’
‘Jupiter’ AGM (triploid)
‘Karmijn de Sonnaville’ (triploid)
‘Katy’ (syn. ‘Katja’)
‘Kidd’s Orange Red’ AGM *
‘King of Tompkins County’ (triploid)
‘King Russett’ AGM
‘Lane’s Prince Albert ‘AGM
‘Langley Pippin’ (partial tip bearer)
‘Loddington’ (syn. ‘Stone’s’)
‘Lord Grosvenor’
‘Lord Hindlip’
‘Malling Kent’
‘Mère de Ménage’
‘Merton Knave’
‘Merton Prolific’
‘Merton Russet’
‘Merton Worcester’ (partial tip bearer)
‘Miller’s Seedling’
‘Mutsu’ (syn. ‘Crispin’) (Triploid) ***
‘New Hawthornden’
‘Norfolk Royal Russet’
‘Ontario’
‘Peasgood’s Nonsuch’ AGM
‘Pinova’
‘Polka’ (syn. ‘Trajan’)
‘Queen’
‘Red Devil’
‘Red Victoria’
‘Redsleeves’
‘Reinette du Canada’ (triploid)
‘Rival’
‘Rosemary Russet’ AGM
‘Rubinette’
‘Saint Cecilia’
‘Saint Everard’
‘Saturn’
‘Scotch Dumpling’
‘Scrumptious’
‘Spartan’
‘Stirling Castle’
‘Sturmer Pippin’
‘S.T. Wright’
‘Sunset’ AGM
‘Taunton Cross’
‘Tom Putt’
‘Tydeman’s Early Worcester’ (tip bearer)
‘Wagener’
‘Waltz’ (syn. ‘Telamon’)
‘Wealthy’
‘Winter Gem’
‘Worcester Pearmain’ AGM (tip bearer)
‘Wyken Pippin’
’
Flowering Group 4 Pollinated by groups 3, 4 & 5
‘Annie Elizabeth’
‘Ashmead’s Kernel’ AGM
‘Autumn Pearmain’
‘Barnack Beauty’
‘Cellini’
‘Chivers Delight’
‘Claygate Pearmain’ AGM
‘Cornish Aromatic’
‘Cornish Gillyflower’ (tip bearer)
‘Cox’s Pomona’
‘D’Arcy Spice’
‘Delicious’
‘Duke of Devonshire’
‘Dumelow’s Seedling’ AGM (syn. ‘Dummellor’s Seedling’ & ‘Wellington’)
‘Ellison’s Orange’ AGM
‘Encore’
‘Gala’
‘George Carpenter’
‘Gladstone’ (tip-bearer)
‘Gloster ‘69’
‘Golden Delicious’ AGM ***
‘Golden Noble’ AGM
‘Hawthornden’
‘Herring’s Pippin’
‘Howgate Wonder’
‘Ingrid Marie’
‘Jester’
‘Joybells’
‘King’s Acre Pippin’
‘Lady Henniker’
‘Lady Sudeley’ (tip bearer)
‘Laxton’s Superb’
‘Laxton’s Pearmain’
‘Lord Burghley’
‘Lord Derby’
‘Mannington’s Pearmain’
‘Merton Joy’
‘Monarch’
‘Orleans Reinette’
‘Pixie’
‘Sir John Thornycroft’
‘Tydeman’s Late Orange’
‘Winston’ AGM
‘WooIbrook Russet’
‘Yellow Newtown Pippin’ (syn. ‘Newtown Pippin’)
Flowering Group 5 Pollinated by groups 4, 5 & 6
‘Coronation’
‘Frogmore Prolific’
‘Gascoyne’s Scarlet’ (triploid)
‘Heusgen’s Golden Reinette’
‘King of the Pippins’ AGM
‘Merton Beauty’
‘Mother’ AGM (syn. ‘American Mother’)
‘Newton Wonder’
‘Northern Spy’
‘Reinette Rouge Etoilée’
‘Royal Jubilee’
‘Suntan’ AGM (triploid) **
‘William Crump’
‘Woolbrook Pippin’
Flowering Group 6 Pollinated by groups 5,6 & 7
‘Bess Pool’
‘Court Pendu Plat’
‘Edward VII’ AGM
‘Laxton’s Royalty’
Flowering Group 7
Very late; pollinated by group 6
‘Crawley Beauty’
The following combinations are incompatible:
‘Cox’s Orange Pippin’ pollinated by ‘Kidd’s Orange Red’ and the reverse.
‘Cox’s Orange Pippin’ is ineffective on ‘Holstein’ and ‘Suntan’, and the reverse.
Golden Delicious may be ineffective on ‘Crispin’ (‘Mutau’).
Royal Raindrops crabapple best fall color
Malus ‘JFS-KW5’ (P.P.No. 14,375) ROYAL RAINDROPS® CRABAPPLE
Zone: 4 Height: 20 ft. Width: 15 ft. Fruit: ¼"
Upright, spreading crabapple with purple cutleaf foliage and orange-red fall color. Bright pinkish-red flowers and small persistent red fruit. Excellent disease resistance.
Brandywine good fall color
Purple Prince good fall color
Hocking Hills orchard-makes own crosses.
GMAL 3563(Kazakhstan) Wild PI 600458 x M. sieversii (Open-Pollinated) cross. Large, ribbed bright crimson skin. Flavor acidic-sweet with pleasant aroma, white flesh with pink inside which is different than most.
GMAL 3781(Kazakhstan) GMAL 3781 x M. sieversii (Open-Pollinated) cross. Medium greenish yellow apple with light pink flesh.
PI 613969(Kazakhstan) Red flesh apple.
PI 629318(Kazakhstan) Red flesh apple.
PI 629319(Kazakhstan) Red flesh apple.
PI 633918(Kazakhstan) Red flesh apple.
PK.14(Tamboz, Russian Federation) Medium size fruit with red skin. Red flesh on the outside, white on the inside.
Best Apples For Dehydrating
- Fuji
- Gala
- Gravenstein
- Granny Smith
- Honeycrisp or Honey Crisp
- Cortland
- Empire
- Goldrush
- Zester
- Pink Lady
- Golden Delicious
- Northern Spy
- Winesap
- Red Delicious
- McIntosh
- Macoun
- Spartan
- Braeburn
- Prairie Sensation
- Prairie Sun
Best uncommon storage apples
Abram
Allum
Arkansas Black
Bald Mountain
Baldwin
Belle de Boskoop
Bentley’s Sweet
Blacktwig
Blushing Golden
Braeburn
Brock
Bryson’s Seedling Cannon Pearmain
Chesney
Chieftain
Chiver’s Delight
Clearwater Gold
Cortland
Cox’s Orange Pippin
Crispin
Criterion
Deaderick
Dixie Red Delight
Domine
Egremont Russet
Empire
Enterprise
Erwin Baur
Gloria Mundi
Gold Rush
Golden Russet
Golden Supreme
Grimes
Holstein Cox
Honey Crisp
Hudson’s Golden Gem
Jonafree
Jonalicious
Jonathan
Kidds Orange Red
King
Liberty
Melrose
Mutsu
Newton
Northern Spy
Northwestern Greening
Oxheart Pippin
Pitmaston Pineapple
Prairie Spy
Priscilla
Red Pippin
Sir Prize
Spartan
Spigold
Spitzenburg
Splendour
Stayman
Stayman-Winesap
Stellar
Suncrisp
Sundance
Turley
Virginia Gold
Winesap (turley, stayman)
Winter Banana
Yates
Abram
Virginia? waxy, greenish-yellow shaded with dull red Late fine-grained and tender with a spicy to sweet flavor
Adam’s Pearmain English dull crimson-red; fine gray-brown russet coat Mid conical fruit, crisp, tender and firm; dry, nutty flavor
Adanac Battleford open pollinated Yellow, striped, red wash Early Good cooking apple, will keep 2-3 months in storage.
Adirondack Crab Unknown Red – Long lasting, profuse clusters of white flowers give way to tiny (1/4") fruit which hang on the tree well into winter.
Akane Jonathan X Worcester Pearmain bright red Early medium-sized; crisp, white juicy flesh; l970 introduction by the Tohoku Agricultural Experimental Station in Japan
The pup is 40 pages long. Naila
4 Likes
The incompatibility issue is more critical if you only have two or three. Once you hit enough trees, and specially if you have some crab apples that are long flowering, the odds are insignificant that you randomly picked all triploid species.
All great information!!
Even though I have quite a few trees, I have been paying attention to pollination groups this year. Esp for outliers groups 1/2 and 5 I had a few early and late not on the list. Would appreciate if you let me know if I’m wrong on these
Group 1
Otterson
Zestar
Group 2
Carter’s blue
Pixie crunch??
Williams pride
Veralma sim
Trailman crab
Both egremont and Edmonds russet
Redfield
Niezewetzykana (from experience)
Group 5
Red Rome
Golden Noble
Hoover??
1 Like
Different seasons (different years), micro-locations, can affect things.
But I put Veralma Simontornya, Redfield, Niedz. all in Group 1.
(Is Zestar really earlier to bloom than Redfield, for instance?)
*I’m just asking, not meaning to criticize your post.
And Rome perhaps in Group 5…assuming there are only 5 or at most 6 groups.
Any list of ‘groups’ is bound to be in error for some locations.
pomiferous.com has the most extensive listing that
I’ve seen.
Thanks @BlueBerry , Niezewetzykana was my earliest to bloom but the other I must have read somewhere. Fortunately 1 and 2 should pollinate each other so we’re still good.
1 Like
Trying to start close to your objectives: I like both Puget Spice and Chestnut Crab. PG is spicy; CC is more mild but still delicious. But neither was quite “golfball size” for me. Centennial is a delicious apple, also very pretty. Good for cider or dessert. And larger than the other two, generally roughly golfball size.
Away from your goals, I’ll agree that the RedByrd varieties are excellent. I grow 4-5 of them, and especially like Red Byrd Bitter and Gnarled Chapman. But they are full-sized apples.
2 Likes
So you’d call the fruit on Franklin Cider trees crabapples, not apples?
1 Like
They are sub 2 inches so yes, they are most definitely crab apples. Given the fact that our friends at Stark Bros were the ones that started marketing them (masters of hoopla) it doesn’t surprise me that they didn’t think this was worth mentioning.
Heck there are a bunch of crab apples worth growing but a lot of people don’t think highly of them.
3 Likes
Here Franklin has been bigger, roughly 2 1/2". That’s twice as big as Puget Spice but 2/3 Rox Russet.
Here’s a picture from a starch test in early Oct. Puget Spice and Franklin are side-by-side, top left.
5 Likes
I communicated with the guy who found the mother Franklin cider tree growing on his place before the variety was brought to market. He never once mentioned it was a crabapple. Maybe that was intentional, or maybe the variety grows differently on it’s own roots than when grafted.
1 Like
Hoping Franklin Cider apple is a decent eating apple, in addition to making cider. I read conflicting reports from spitter to pretty good right off the tree.
1 Like
I’ve read/heard nothing but spitter, but that was only from fewer than 10 growers.
From what I’ve read, it definitely won’t be my kind of apple for fresh eating. I pretty much bought my two F.C. trees for wildlife, so it won’t be a huge loss if they’re essentially inedible to humans.
Stark Bros. isn’t the only one not mentioning F.C. being a crabapple…Cummins Nursery says “The fruit is small-medium”. No mention of crabapple. They call it an apple.
I look forward to seeing what my two trees produce.
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IMO, it’s a great cider apple. Whether someone would use it as a dessert apple depends on their tastes.
I’ve eaten it “right off the tree” and I definitely would not say “spitter.” But you have to like an apple that is moderately sweet, somewhat tart and also tannic. As advertised, it’s bitter-sharp. But not “gag me” bitter-sharp.
Maybe another way to say this is that I don’t think you’d have to blend Franklin juice when making cider. The juice is drinkable. For me, this is a contrast with a true spitter which you would use only as 5-20% of a blend.
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Some of the stuff I read says crab is anything under 2". Other stuff I see says crab to mean any non domestica malus species or hybrid. What definition are you all talking about here?
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