Questions not deserving of a whole thread


Thanks. I will plan on covering the grapes then.


No, never found one. I think it was a bug that eats only from the outside…


I mixed copper at 1/2 strength and while I am indeed late this year, I have done it after leaves were out before at 1/2 strength and not had any problems. Its probably too late to do much good but I’d bought it and decided to throw it in. I was trying to get some help with a few different things including fire blight, peach leaf curl, brown rot, rust, and black rot, and powdery mildew ion some bushes I spray. I am aware of some of the objections you may have and I’m not saying this late of a spray helped with some of those things (for example, I get that its too late for peach leaf curl). But this tank was a general mix that I was using on a VERY wide variety of fruit trees and bushes, some of which the copper may have helped and others it didnt. I’m also aware that I used 3 anti fungal components but my experience is that each one has certain things it is more effective at controlling while some don’t control certain things. I get it, but like I said, I am pretty happy with my spray and while I acknowledge that there is some duplication (and therefore some wasted money) But again, I didn’t want to debate my spray components in this post as much as find out how long I could keep my mixed spray before using it.

@k8tpayaso well, it rained from the time I mixed my spray until dark!!! So I had no choice whatsoever but to wait until the next morning. I did spray it all at that point, but I’m still left with my original question of whether it will now be effective or did it degrade while sitting suspended in water for 15 hours??

@dimitri_7a and @Drew51 thanks for that …and one thing I should have mentioned which directly applies to what you said is that I also add vinegar to my spray mix every time, for exactly what you just mentioned…I’ve read that slightly more acidic water led to better longevity of mix. Hope its true!


This year looked so good, but Mother Nature is not done messing with us! I think the mix should be fine. Cooper it turns out likes neutral water. I guess the copper can become too strong and hurt the tree. But only if growing. So copper sprays during the growing season should be mixed with plain tap water. Same with lime-sulfur mixes.
I myself have only used these sprays with acidic water while dormant, and saw no harm. But I think I will start sticking to tap for these sprays. Nothing is easy :slight_smile:
We live and learn! The MSU and Florida document I linked to mentions this about copper
From the MSU document
“Do not attempt to acidify solutions containing copper-based fungicides, since copper becomes more soluble at a lower pH and may become phytotoxic to crops. In addition, phosphorous acid and other acid-based fungicides should not be acidified since they already have a low pH and lowering it could cause phytotoxicity. On the other hand, acidifying carbonate salt fungicides, such as Armicarb, may render them ineffective.”

The Florida document
"There are a few pesticidal materials that should not be acidified under any circumstances: sprays containing fixed copper fungicides (Bordeaux mixture, copper oxide, basic copper sulfate, copper hydroxide, etc.) and lime and lime sulfur. Their labels will contain specific statements."

I have not seen those so called statements! Anyway why I linked all three documents as all contain critical info.

I still think though having copper acidified is not going to hurt anything and may make the stuff even more effective against say peach leaf curl. I have never seen any damage at all to dormant trees. If your trees are showing signs of life avoid acidifying copper and sulfur.
In dormant season acidifying the weak kneed copper sulfates they pass off as fungicides actually may make them effective! I use hydroxide which is the best form of copper to use in dormant sprays.


I have used 1/2 strength copper on apples just before bloom, but as far as I know copper is worthless on peaches after they start to leaf, with the exception of treating canker.


I lost 90% of the peach buds so far this year so I think I will start spraying the tree with Kocide now.


I agree with that completely. But I still have some apples that haven’t bloomed (honey crisp) and this mix was a general use mix that I was using on those apples and a lot of other things. And I have seen several articles suggesting that copper can help with other fungi like those I listed above (but agree its not helpful for peaches at this point). SO yea, I wasted a little money but it might have helped on some of my other fruits and fungi. If not, no big deal, But thanks for your help.

@Drew51 those articles really were helpful and interesting. I remember you used to use battery acid but like you said, we are always learning and evolving. Seems like I change something every year!


Yes I have made so many mistakes. Seems I learn better when I do it. I already made one this year, but I don’t want to talk about it :slight_smile:
I need battery acid for breeding brambles. The seed has a coat meant to go through a stomach. We digest our food with sulfuric acid. So I have to soak them 20 to 40 minutes in sulfuric acid to get them to germinate. So I used it for water treatment too. I usually have enough rainwater these days. . I need to have it on hand still. My current project is to breed for a primocane fruiting Yellow cap raspberry (the black raspberries’ version of yellow raspberries). Lynn’s Black which is soon to be become world famous :slight_smile: was bred by me. I have others but this one stands out.


I have my battery acid ready to go. But what soil medium do you start your seeds in. I have just about 12 seeds of the species I with to grow and I want to give them the best chance.


I have so many projects I have to make things simple. I use the peat moss based (and cheapest) Pro Mix, and i add a little large particle DE in. Any Pro Mix can be used by itself too. Bramble seeds also need to be cold stratified. So what I do is use a nursery flat tray that holds Propagation trays. I fill it with soil.You can use perforated or not trays. After scarification (battery acid) I wash the seeds well and you set them right on top of the soil. I don’t use dividers but you could. Press them in slightly. And I keep them moist all winter in the garage. You could put them in the fridge too. I leave them all winter and then put them outside with overhead protection but full sun. The seeds need light to germinate.
Bramble seeds are about the hardest thing ever to germinate. An alternate is to plant somewhere outside and wait two years. In 2 years the coating wears off and they will germinate. No easy answer here.

My pink raspberry is doing well too. I named it Irene, I think I’ll rename it Irene’s Pink.
It’s green, then yellow, then orange then pink! (Polka(pollen) x Anne(flower))

The problem with this cultivar is it looks just like Double Gold. Taste of both is excellent yet not the same. Some other differences too. They do not fruit at the same time.
Double Gold does not turn orange first. But the end product looks identical. I wanted an orange and I will try again. I want to cross Cascade Gold and Josephine. I’m not going to try till next year. Working on the yellow cap this year. If I have time I may attempt the cross.


Uh, hydrochloric (HCl) actually.


I have been corrected! Yes, good catch!


Can some of you please tell me approximately how many gallons of liquid spray (doesn’t matter whats in it too much) you use on average when spraying a mature peach tree? I seem to use just under 2 gallons when I use my battery powered sprayer but I really soak each tree pretty well. Is that in line with most of you, or am I too heavy handed (or even too conservative- which I doubt).

I imagine those with air/mist sprayers use considerably less but I’m interested in results from all types of sprayers. For example, those with pump-up sprayers, how many full size semi dwarf peach trees can you spray (ie how many gallon per tree). Those with regular battery sprayers like mine please chime in too. whatever you use, I’d like to know how many gallon you apply per tree.


Is there a rule of thumb about how many gallon to spray a fruit tree?

My semi dwarf peach trees are not as full as your trees (from the old pics). I use about 2/3 - one gallon per tree. It is a pump sprayer.


It looks like nobody answered this? The ammonia smell is normal. Also the look.


I’m surprised to here about this. I spray one gallon hand held sprayer on 10 trees. Now I’m wondering if I’m not giving them a good spray every time. But I do have much younger/smaller trees than you two.


A full grown peach tree that has lot of leaves does need good coverage. I spray 2 mature peach and 2 younger peach trees with about 3 gal of spray.


I usually don’t use much at all. In the summer the only problems are the fruit, bugs, fungi. If spaying for leaf problems that’s different. I use more. So I only spray the fruit during the summer. I may spray the ground and trunk to keep insects off. Most of my sprays are to protect the fruit, so it is all I spray. I’m trying to only spray for what I have problems with. I don’t have fungal or insects problems concerning the leaves. If I do, then I’ll spray them.


Cool. Thank you. I almost threw out the bottle. :blush: I will use it.


How do you spray the fruit without hitting branches and leaves?

Also, for PC, spraying twings and branches help as they like to walk from one fruit to the next.