Thanks for the update, Vault. I’m in the top of the hill country but I’m up on a rocky hill. I’ve read about the horrors of cotton root rot on Texas apples. I’m wondering if there is any correlation between low spots like yours and the bacteria that causes cotton root rot. Maybe that’s my wishful thinking kicking in. My oldest apples are going on year three, so I don’t have much data to go off of yet.
Watched a fascinating video from the Heritage Orchard group about fireblight. Covered why some varieties are more sensitive (genetics), the advantage of Geneva rootstocks, and the work going on to provide fireblight resistant but also tasty apples
March 15th, 2023
Genetics & Breeding for Fire Blight Resistance
Gennaro Fazio - USDA-ARS - Geneva, NY & Awais Kahn - Cornell University
Kahn showed data that suggested, all things being equal, rootstocks with bigger root systems were more resistant. He showed the chromosomes on crab apples that contribute to their excellent overall resistance to disease. Also a new study which allows for fruit production in less than a year to speed up testing of apple varieties.
Very interesting! Worthwhile to join and have access to all the webinars.
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Thanks for posting this info. Looks like a great site.
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Hey @BlueBerry … found this vid of someone eating… taste test report for HGG last night.
He was impressed.
Mine is 4 yr old this year… will be glad when i get to try some.
Ps… my apples most are on M7 which is reported to be very resistent to FB.
I do have one novamac on b9… and another i grafted to M7. M7 does well here.
But my Gold Rush on M7… several hits of FB last year.
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Thanks. Sounds great.
I grafted it among my first dozen or 2 some 5 or more years ago. But, I didn’t nurture it, and I think it died from drought…at lest the top is dead. Might sprout from older trunk but odds not good. So, I’ve got one on order on B-9 rootstock. Should get me a bloom next year maybe.
Yes and no. So the extension experts say you can get cotton root rot anywhere (fungus, not bacteria), that it’s not limited to old fields. It’s natively in the soil. But…my orchard is in an old field. And in my area, alot of the grape planing (gets cotton root rot too) or other orchard plantings, are going into spots that were probably farmed at once time. And I have seen scattered trees in peoples yards survive, where when planted in mass, they are more likely to perish. So you should be safer up there on that rocky hill unless it comes in with introduced soil.
Cotton root rot is not supposed to flourish in dry soils. Soils high in organic matter are supposed to keep it at bay. Acidic soils too. Mulch for several years unfortunately wasn’t enough.
With that orchard planting, I planted the apple trees far apart, with two pomegranates between them, at least fifteen feet between each tree. Pomegranates are not supposed to get cotton root rot (they are fine, just keep freezing to the ground except one Russian 18). The goal was for it to hit a pomegranate area and then stop, but unfortunately that did not work, or I have multiple hot spots throughout the field.
Have you ever heard of root shield and root shield plus? Apparently they are beneficial fungi that deter destructive soil borne fungi. I’ve heard people say that it works but I have no experience with it myself. Another thing I’m looking into is using the native Blanco crabapple as a rootstock. It’s from the alkaline soils of the hill country and may help with the PH and drought tolerance.
I think that’s what actinovate is supposed to do, but I am not sure. I will look into root shield.
If you are looking for Blanco Crabapples, Natives of Texas outside Kerrville has had the trees in the past. Call before you go. I also met a guy in Johnson City who knows a trick for propagating them from seed. I’d have to dig the name and contact information up though.
Just be forewarned. Blanco crabapples grow very very very slowly.
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Thank you for the recommendation. I spoke with a guy who was a collector from wild populations of Blanco crab, and he seemed unsure as to whether or not the guy in Kerrville had the real deal or whether he was just propagating regular prairie crab. It may be that regular prairie crab will do the same thing for me and with a little more vigor, but the only way to find out is to test. If you happen to find the gentleman’s contact who knows the germination trick please do let me know.
Thanks Vault
I really like Williams’ Pride
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Hi @kingwood, I would like to start some apples in south Houston. Would you please update your experience on growing apples in Houston. What grew and fruited the best? Thanks.
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Hi all: After reading this thread over several days, this is summary of my understanding
Please share which varieties are low chill (250-400 h) as those probably will do best in southeast Texas. Thank you
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My Belle de Boskoop has little if any resistance to this year’s fire blight. My previous rose colored comments about it failed to include a bad blight year experience. I got lulled into thinking our ten year vacation from blight had become the new normal.
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Three different times I grafted this. All grafts took and lasted just a year…Seems it’s one that doesn’t live in an organic/no spray orchard. Sounds promising…so I might graft and try again if I come across some scion. Maybe add it to a multi-graft tree and see if that makes a difference.
@BBF, from your list I’ve grown williams pride, liberty, sundance, sundowner, ark blk, priscilla, winesap (old fashioned).
Here’s how I’d order those based on chill hours from highest chill to lowest. This is based on observations with annual chill hours ranging from mid 500s to about 1100 over the last 10 years in SE AL.
ark blk, liberty, winesap, will pride, sundance, priscilla, sundowner.
Ark blk and liberty had some major problems breaking bud in warm years for me - the rest have been mostly fine although this year winesap was a little delayed in bloom but was still able to get a decent crop. I’ve read chilling is not a big issue because eventually they will flower and set fruit. That may be true in a dry area but we get so much rain here that if bloom is delayed into summer then the warm daily rains coincide with blooms which makes fireblight go absolutely bonkers and your trees will likely get killed. This year ark blk was blooming into june (march-april in a cold winter for comparison) - so I picked off all the blooms so I wouldnt have to keep spraying strep for FB. That means no fruit from ark blk, whcih does not bother me much because it never tastes very good in my yard.
I’d recommend lady williams as another lower chill apple that has tasted OK for me - not great but OK. It really needs to hang a long long time to get good flavor. In my yard it didnt really seem to ripen until into January, but some years we get temps in the high teens/low 20s by then which caused some damage to the fruit. If you are closer to the Gulf then it might work better becasue you could let it hang longer into the winter than I can. I have not given up on it though - still going to try a few more years. It seems about average for rot and fireblight.
I’d add a column for bitter rot resistance if you are in a wet area, which I think would include E TX but I’m not certain. All those on the list seemed about the same for rot although I’d probably put winesap as the least prone to rot compared with the rest, but all those seem to rot a lot less than goldrush in my yard.
in my opinion, winesap is going to be tops for flavor from the ones I’ve grown followed by sundance then sundowner. Priscilla and will pride were not that great and the margin for error on picking time is small because it is so dang hot when they ripen that they get overripe fast compared with later apples. Sundowner I’m putting third for flavor but they were not a great apple - they never seemed to sweeten up in my yard and I let them hang into dec and were fully ripe. Libery seemed pretty nice flavored, but I never got enough of them to really judge before FB killed the tree.
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Do you let Sundance hang on the tree a long time? Still hanging here 7B Maryland but this is first year of figuring out when to pick. Hoping for blend of sweet/tart.
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Hi @barry, thank you for detailed information and suggestions for selection. We do get too much rain and the drought and few freeze days so weather is not very friendly for growing apples with added rot stress. I will still try the suggested varieties and update here.
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I let sundance hang for a range of lengths of time to try to figure them out. Something about the flavor was just kind of bland and the texture is bouncy like a golden delicious. Overall a much better apple than storebought GD but just kind of mildly sweet and boring. They would ripen pretty late around early to mid-Oct here - just a little earlier than peak goldrush. It was such a strong grower that the graft was taking over one branch of my goldrush tree so I cut it out. I still have it as a small whip in my nursery bed in case I want to do something with it again.
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Is it Ashe cedar there, also known as blueberry cedar? Because it is supposed to be immune to cedar apple rust. I don’t know if that’s true, but it’s what the literature says
I’m also in the Houston area and wondering from where did you purchase your trees? I have a small space to grow and have been researching varieties/rootstocks. Thanks for the heads up on G.41, it was one I had my eyes on along with G.969.