There are six known human flavor senses of flavor: sweet, sour, etc. Savory is one of them. It is due to the presence of glutens in foods. MSG is a famous artificial gluten. The public has recently become aware of glutens in wheat - the term for which has unfortunately been shortened to gluten. The gluten forms found in other foods are each different and so far as we know not associated with Celiac disease. They are associated with the sense of savory and very often in protein form. As a consequence fruits (peaches and tomatoes being prime examples) high in gluten are quicker to rot; I.e. shorter shelf life. Breeding programs that emphasized shelf life thus bred savory out of the fruit. This is one of the main reasons that “home orchard” cultivars taste so much better than those bred in the prior century for supermarkets.
These are my favorite! I should get a lot this year as I have been putting in rows of them. Mine are just the wild ones that I transplant from the flower gardens. They grow like weeds here but if not protected from the deer they wont put any good foliage on. I put a row going down the hill of my deer fence that should do good next year. All together I should have about 150’ of blacks.
Nice! I just have a small patch. Where are you located? I’ve been told there are just a few small pockets where people grow black caps, SE PA being one.
I live in S.E. Mich. They grow all over the Midwestern states.
Black Rasps (Black Caps) grow wonderfully from Northeast PA down through Central Maryland-- has been my first-hand experience. I’ve read they are loaded w/ antioxidants. They are easy to transplant and one of my most rewarding and carefree fruit plants. Here’s a pic of mine from July 7 of last year:
They grow all over my region here in WV. I picked a pint of them last week along some ATV trails I ride on. They aren’t one of my favorites as they are too seedy for my tastes. I much prefer blackberries.
Wow, totally opposite of me. I find the blackberries with the seeds so big and gritty to be a yuck factor to why I don’t pick them. We have those grow all over too. I don’t much notice the smaller seeds in raspberries. I know your not alone because so many talk about growing them and not the raspberries.
This is a Bristol Black Raspberry that’s fruiting for the first time this year.I tasted a couple berries and they were okay,maybe not completely ripe yet.I also have a young Jewel.Is anyone familiar with these that can recommend a more flavorful variety? Brady
Anyone growing Ohio Treasure black raspberry? It’s primocane bearing.
Richard, I believe there are only 5 taste senses, sweet, sour, salty, bitter and umami (savory). Gluten is not the same compound as glutamate (which is what stimulates the umami taste sensors). The fruit of most flowering plants have endosperms with stored protein to nourish embryonic plants during germination. True gluten, with gliadin and glutenin, is limited to certain members of the grass family. The stored proteins of maize and rice are sometimes called glutens, but their proteins differ from true gluten. Glutamate compounds that stimluate the umami taste sensors can be found in many fermented and aged foods (soy sauce and cheeses as examples), and this taste is also present in tomatoes, grains, and beans. Monosodium glutamate will also elicit a strong umami taste response. But it is the glutamate, not gluten that is eliciting the response. This is the informaiton from the FDA web site about MSG:
“Does “glutamate” in a product mean it contains gluten? No—glutamate or glutamic acid have nothing to do with gluten. A person with Celiac disease may react to the wheat that may be present in soy sauce, but not to the MSG in the product.”
I have Celiac disease, my mother did as well. It is an autoimmune disorder and is an allergy to the amino acid, gliadin in the compound, glueten. I have no problems ingesting any fruits or MSG. Don’t particularly like the taste of MSG, but I do not have any issues with ingesting it. Fortunately for me, my Celiac is only weakly expressed. My mother could not eat any gluten at all, or she would have very severe symptoms, along with a celiac-enduced psoriasis so badly, the skin over her joints would would crack and bleed.
You’re agreeing with me loudly.
Those look great Matt! I put Jewel in this year.
I ate some North Country blueberries today. Warm yummy blueberry bites. They did not last long enough for a picture. 
Well, not really 
Not to put a fine point on it, but being a nurse, and having Celiac disease myself, there are some clarifications I’ve tried to make, but here it is in the fine point:
“There are six known human flavor senses of flavor: sweet, sour, etc.” Nope, just 5.
“Savory is one of them. It is due to the presence of glutens in foods.” Nope. NOT gluten. Glutamate. Glutamate is not gluten.
“MSG is a famous artificial gluten.” See above.
“The public has recently become aware of glutens in wheat - the term for which has unfortunately been
shortened to gluten.” Gluten in wheat is gluten. Nothing has been shortened. That IS the name of the composite protein. The public has been aware of glutens for some time, but sadly, there has been a lot of misinformed hype around gluten right now. There is this craze going on that folks should avoid glutens. There is absolutely no reason the vast majority of the public should avoid glutens. Only about .5-1.0% of the USA population has Celiac disease - the only reason you would want to avoid gluten. Think we’ve known about this for some time, just that uneducated health food kooks have taken this off the charts. Sort of like the crazy 80’s conception that a bunch of us were suffering from hyoglycemia. Just a marketing ploy by some companies to sell more stuff because the world is now all of a sudden terrified of gluten.
“The gluten forms found in other foods are each different and so far as we know not associated with Celiac disease.” - That is because the compounds found in these foods are not gluten. So, yes, they will be different, because they are NOT gluten. (That’s like calling fat, starch, and saying the starch in red meat is different than the starch in a potato). These listed plants contain proteins that can stimulate the umami taste sensors, but they are not the same proteins that form the compound substance called gluten. Gluten is the composite of the storage proteins gliadin and a glutenin, and is conjoined with starch in the endosperm of various grass-related grains.
“They are associated with the sense of savory and very often in protein form. As a consequence fruits (peaches and tomatoes being prime examples) high in gluten are quicker to rot; I.e. shorter shelf life.” - Peaches rot faster for many different reasons - thinner, less waxy skin to prevent rot organisms from entering, having a high respiratory rate due to high sugar content, high ethylene gas production, less preservatives used (commercial fruit), but not because they contain gluten. They do not contain gluten.
Richard, you are a wealth of information, and clearly very experienced and very informed, but truly, I promise you, this is not gluten. I am not a chemist, but I am sure one of our chemists will eventually comment about the actual structure of glutamate and gluten. And, the various endosperm proteins found in other fruits that can elicit that umami taste sensation, but it is not gluten in those fruits that is doing that.
I saw a great show recently that indicated MSG is thought to be the reason people have loved the taste of garum for thousands of years (fermented fish sauce). The fish intestine seems to produce MSG as it decays and that stimulates the human the brain to think, oh gee this is fish that sat in the sun and rotted for three months but wow its YUMMY.
I’ve grow Jewel Black caps here for the last 3 years, while a bit on the seedy side, they are wonderful for baking, jamming, sorbets, and we eat bunch before they get in the house too. They are more tart than any of my reds and smaller in size, but the actual raspberry flavor is intense and finishes on the sweet side. Once they turn black the berries are ready to go, but I let them hang another day for good measure.
I love the growth habit, they have yet to sucker, new primocanes come up through the crown, I prune at 48" then the laterals and 12" and 12" again depending on the season. I let the laterals go all the way to ground and tip root them into pots to overwinter. I was 11 of 11 successfully rooted and overwintered in 1# pots with just some leaf much for protection,
I got a pack of skittles, dark green label “Orchard flavors”, I like the peach one.
I’m eating black caps at this moment, love 'em! I don’t know why I like them more than reds, they are small and seedy. Maybe it was the thrill of picking all those wild patches as a kid.
Patty, I also have some sort of gluten sensitivity, its pretty bad and I can’t eat any gluten.
I’m getting ready to pick my two Sweet Treat pluerries tomorrow, I’ll report back on them (poor set due to the Burgundy plum not blooming quite at the same time). Frustrating, isn’t it, Scott? I LOVE bread. Love it. I can eat some, but not too much. Pizza is a killer (anything unleavened, just too big a gluten punch). So, I pick my battles. Two of my daughters also have even milder symptoms. Glad the condition seems to be diluting itself out of our genes. Some folks are so sensitive they can’t even have things like creamy salad dressings that have been thickened with wheat based products.
You can dig a shallow trench next to the plant and bend the cane into it. Cut the bottom leaves off and burry it so the upward leaves are sticking out. It will send a bunch of suckers up. It wont hurt if the cane gets a kink in it when you bend it down but you want to be connected for best results.
Nice looking apricot 