Here is a video I found of someone walking through their persimmon orchard and tasting a variety of American persimmons. Interesting comments on the aesthetics of the various varieties as well.
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That was fun. Thanks for sharing the video.
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Some delicious 100-46 have been dropping for a week or so. They practically start dehydrating on the tree, shriveling somewhat. The flavor is very rich with a jammy texture and it’s not too perfumed.
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Remind me that I need to find someone with seed in their 100-46. I would love to grow some and see what comes from it.
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My 100-46 aren’t ripe yet, but getting close. I just have 3 fruit on a tiny tree, but last year (when the tree was even smaller and insisted on fruiting) they had seeds, so if I find seeds this year you are welcome to them. All my Prok this year had between 3 and 5 seeds each, so there is a good chance there will be seeds in my 100-46, There must be a wild male nearby that is pollinating them, so no promise on what one side of the family tree is offering.
I think my ripening is behind @PharmerDrewee even though I’m further south because the Caddo blackberries have grown huge and are shading my little 100-46 and it was already in only part sun.
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"No. From his own writings…John Gordon picked these from populations of seedlings he grew out. ‘SAA’ meant 'Saved As “A”(meaning #1/the best), 'Saved as ‘‘B’’. ‘Saved as ‘C’’. etc.
So… SAA Overleese was his pick as the best Overleese seedling, SAA Zimmerman was his pick as the best seedling of Zimmerman, etc. "
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Clark, I know this is a bit off topic but wanted to bring this thread on Zirochka to your attention if you are interested in pursuing that route for trial Persimmon Zirochka/Zirocka/Zirotschka
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There could also be large variations in wake up times based upon the seedling rootstock a persimmon is grown on. There are some which wake up way later, these are the ones that are preferred for grafting to amongst other qualities. Since there are no standard methods (currently) for persimmon rootstock propagation, and no named rootstocks I’m aware of like apples have M111 etc, it’s basically a crapshoot as to rootstock performance.
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Yes, some rootstocks wake up slightly later or go to sleep slightly sooner than others. But, there is not a huge amount of variability in that here, especially when we get hit by a blast of sustained heat in the spring. Also, the results I observed were across a variety of rootstocks (multiple sources, seedlings, and seeds) in different locations. There was some consistency in the damage that occurred to specific varieties across all of these variables. The varieties not afflicted by such issues are making fruit and can stay. The others with inferior taste or issues handling a harsh climates will be targeted for grafting to other varieties.
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This year i will try to grow
WS8-10 aka Barbara ’s Blush
100-46 aka Lehmans delight
100-42 Englands called these Large Fruit, Great tasting and similar to 100-46
H63A
i94
Dollywood aka D-128
I was successful with the grafts of
Early golden
Prarie star
Prarie sun
The drought murdered many late season grafts.
Any other suggestions are appreciated!
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Sorry to hear about your late season grafts, I had high hopes for your success.
A/118 is one on my add list this year.
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How is the flavor? They look like the Early Golden I had this year. The flavor wasn’t as intense as others though.
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I was very hopeful. They grew very well at first, but the drought could not be helped or controlled. All the extra water i had was not enough to make a dent in the dry weather we had. My ponds are down 12 feet of water. This drought is excessive.
Good flavor, like a persimmon ought to taste. I don’t remember it being intense. It had the most pulp per pound of any I tried this year, averaged 4 seeds per fruit.
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I feel your pain. I started a small orchard in the corner of a field that would never grow a crop because it was too wet. Put in field tile to drain it, never saw a drop of water come out of the tile and had to pack water to the new trees all summer.
We’ll see in the spring if they got enough water to survive.
My pond has an island in it that appeared this year. Never had one before.
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A118 was not as good as the others this year. Atleast here in the cool summer PNW climate.
But it makes large fruit.
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Anyone have opinions on these other than what is stated above already?
Claypool A-118 (Elmo) according to
Elmo American Persimmon Tree - Stark Bro’s Zones 4 - 9 The Elmo American Persimmon is a hand-pollinated cross of Golden Supreme and Garretson Persimmon. It is also referred to as Claypool A-118. Chosen for its reliable crop of large fruits resistant to both pests and diseases. Elmo Persimmon is known for its heavy bearing. In Fall, enjoy harvesting large, orange, flavorful fruit with no black spots.
Claypool C-100 - according to Diospyros virginiana 'C-100' (C-100 Common Persimmon, Eastern Persimmon, Possumwood) | North Carolina Extension Gardener Plant Toolbox
C-100 is a medium-sized cultivar in the Ebenaceae family whose parent plant is native to central and eastern United States. It is beautiful, delicious and easy to grow, and offers year-round interest in the landscape. Bred by the late James Claypool, its fruit resembles the ‘Morris Burton’ cultivar in look and taste.
Claypool H-118 according to Prairie Star® American Persimmon - One Green World
Prairie Star® American Persimmon
One of the earliest ripening American Persimmon varieties, Prairie Star® American Persimmon is prized for its unusually large, very sweet, firm and flavorful fruit. Apparently self-fertile, Prairie Star™ fruit is also seedless in our orchard. (Claypool H-118 cv.)
One of our best native American fruits and hardy to minus 25 °F, American Persimmon can be grown in all but the coldest regions of the U.S. Our hard-to-find, grafted varieties produce bountiful crops of delicious, light-orange fruit. American Persimmon fruit is ready to eat when it is soft like a tomato and is great for fresh eating and for making delectable cookies, cakes, and other treats. American Persimmon trees are easy to keep 10-12 ft in height with pruning.
They like full to half day sun and can grow on most soils. Our varieties are partially to fully self-fertile but all will bear heavier crops with a Male tree for pollination. Naturally pest and disease resistant, our American Persimmon varieties can produce 30 lbs. or more of fruit and often begin bearing the 2nd or 3rd year after planting.
Latin Name Diospyros virginiana
Site and Soil: Persimmons like 1/2 day to full sun and well-drained soil
Rootstock Description Grafted onto American Persimmon rootstock
Pollination Requirements: Prairie Star® is self-fertile. Plant with our Male Persimmon to ensure good crops
Hardiness: Hardy to minus 25°F.
Bearing Age: 2-3 years after planting
Size at Maturity: Can be kept at 12ft with regular pruning. (Without pruning Persimmon can reach upwards of 20ft)
Taste: Sweet
Fruit Size Large
Bloom Time June
Ripening Time: Late September
Yield: 30+ lbs.
Pests & Diseases: With proper care and placement Persimmon trees are not bothered by pests or diseases
USDA Zone: 4-9
Claypool I-94 according to I 94 American Persimmon Tree - Stark Bro’s
I 94 American Persimmon is also known as Claypool 1-94 or Valeen Beauty. This Large fruit has clear flesh with excellent flavor. Claypool I-94 is large, early, and delicious. It differs from Early Golden by being slightly larger, more oblate and brighter orange color. Another interesting trait of Claypool I-94 is its very large and glossy leaves, making it a beautiful tree year-round.
1-94 American Persimmons ripen in October to November. Come harvest in the fall, you’ll easily spot the bright orange fruit. The fruit softens and sweetens once they experience frost.
Dollywood - according to Dollywood Persimmon – Bass Pecan
Dollywood Persimmon
(Diospryros virginiana) Zone 5-9
Dollywood Persimmon is a seedling of Early Golden, the first named persimmon cultivar. It is a heavy producer of very large high-quality fruit. Dollywood has a spreading growth habit with drooping branches which is unusual for an American persimmon.
Fruit Drop: September - October
Early Golden - according to Early Golden American Persimmon - One Green World
One of the best American Persimmon Varieties, Early Golden American Persimmon has 1-1/2″ diameter fruit that becomes very sweet and deep orange when ripe, with a delicious taste not unlike dates.
Garretson according to Garretson American Persimmon Tree - Stark Bro’s
An early-ripening, cold-hardy persimmon!
Hardy all the way up to zone 4! The Garretson American Persimmon is a seedling of Early Golden, making it a relatively early ripener and it has been noted to ripen as far north as Geneva NY, and Grant MI. The small to medium-sized fruit is a rich orange color, soft with good flavor and small seeds. The Garretson American Persimmon is known for its high yields.
John Rick according to Home Garden Persimmons | UGA Cooperative Extension
Productive, excellent flavor and firmness with 2-8 seeds.
Killen according to Home Garden Persimmons | UGA Cooperative Extension
Good flavor and firm fruit. Medium sized and moderately productive.
Lena - according to American persimmon - Lena
Lena (Mitchellana) was winner of the Mitchell Indiana Persimmon Festival in 1955.
American persimmon variety that is well regarded for it’s flavor, tender skin and attarctive red color. .
Often mentioned as one of the best tasting persimmons. Good for pulp or fresh.
Ripens early over a long period. Late ripening.
Zone 5-9
Morris Burton - according to Early Producing Morris Burton Persimmon - Blue Hill Wildlife Nursery
Fruit is small to medium at best with an ok flavor
Female persimmon that is self-fruitful(we have no male trees) and early producing. Morris Burton bears heavy crops of persimmons annually that very slowly drop beginning in late October and continue into winter. This persimmon fully ripens on the trees in central Pennsylvania but sheds very little fruit and holds most of it throughout the winter. This would be an excellent choice if you’re looking for persimmons falling late in the year in the Deep South. Morris Burton produces 1 1/2″ – 2″ persimmons with an ok flavor, in my opinion. This tree is vigorous, early producing, typically producing the 3rd year. Mature height 40′-60′. Plant hardiness zones 5-9.
Wabash - according to Worth trying American persimmon?
The flavor is second rate and fruit is small and unremarkable
Weber - according to https://ediblelandscaping.com/products/weber-persimmon-1?variant=41928285651113
Weber came to us from Alabama. It is an early ripening Native persimmon with an enjoyable flavor and deep orange, almost red flesh. The fruits are larger than most native persimmons and ripens well before frost. Space 15’ circle Zone 6-8 perhaps Zone 5
Yates (Juhl) - according to Yates American Persimmon Tree - Stark Bro’s
A sweet native of Indiana. This fast-growing variety is pest- and disease-resistant. When fruit is soft and completely mature, it features a sweet, apricot-like flavor. Cold-hardy and heat-tolerant. Tree reaches 35-50’ tall. Ripens in early September.
According to American Persimmon (Diospyros virginiana) – The Fruit Nut
" In 1880 the first named American persimmon was selected out of the wild in Illinois. This original variety, ‘Early Golden’, would go on to be the female parent for many of the cultivars developed throughout the twentieth century. Elwyn Meader of Rochester, New Hampshire, was interested in American persimmons and developed one supposed self-fruitful cultivar called ‘Meader’. Another one of the more famous American persimmon breeders was the late James Claypool who began his work in the 1970’s. He also worked with Professor J.C. McDaniel from the Unniversity of Illinois whom is responsible for selecting ‘John Rick’ and ‘Florence’ (5). Over the course of 20+ years Claypool evaluated over 2,000 trees and kept extensive orchard records describing the characteristics of each tree in his breeding project. As Claypool’s health declined in the early 1990’s various members of the Indiana Nut Growers Association decided to carry on his work (1); one of those individuals was Jerry Lehman, who has a 60-acre orchard in Terra Haute, IN. He has been working with persimmons there ever since and has a large repository containing some of the most diverse American persimmon genetics in the world. The breeding aims today remain largely the same as Claypool’s original criteria (1):
1.Reduce the long ripening period
2.Improve fruit size
3.Calyx holding to fruit when dropping from the tree
4.Increase the already wonderful flavor
5.Skin tough enough to hold fruit when it strikes ground
6.Better the color of skin or attractiveness
7.Reduce seed numbers
8.Eliminate black spots in fruit flesh
9.Improve pulp color & longevity when frozen
Out of all the above criteria the first point seems to be the most important for extending the range and viability of American persimmons as a crop in the Midwest. Brix testing should also be done to determine peak ripeness; in the case of ‘Prok’ we’ve seen and tasted samples that look ripe, feel ripe, lack any astringency, but taste bland and borderline insipid. Insufficient heat units may inhibit certain cultivars from developing their full sugar content. Another goal is to find and identify more individuals that exhibit self fruitfulness. My primary focus is to plant as many cultivars as possible to trial for the above criteria. The hope is to determine which of the existing cultivars are most likely to succeed under a short season.
CULTIVARS:
My persimmon plantings are all in their adolescence and haven’t begun to bear. However, I am affiliated with a network of individuals around the state who are growing persimmons; many of the varietal images below come from those orchards. Through the Michigan Nut Growers Association we’ve established joint efforts to assess a wide range of cultivars over the next decade. This process will become increasingly sophisticated and systematic in our approach. In 2011/12 I planted ‘Szukis’, ‘Yates’,’Prok’, ‘Ennis Seedless’, ‘Sugar Bear’, and the kaki X virginiana variety, ‘Rosseyanka’. In the spring of 2013 I received several cultivars of scionwood from Jerry Lehman which were grafted onto seedling understock with around an 80% success rate. Those varieties are as follows:
Mohler
L32
Killen
H-118
GL
NC-10
WS8-10
Garreston
J-59
C-100
A-118
These came from a ‘Yates’ seedling tree. Very high quality and good size. Grown by Hank and Nghi Frehtling in Willianston, MI. Photo taken October 6th, 2013
‘Prok’ and ‘Geneva Long’ grown by Hank and Nghi Frehtling in Willianston, MI. Hank noted the warm microclimate where he planted the trees—this may have aided in ripening. Photo taken October 6th, 2013
‘Geneva Long’ cross section. One of John Gordon’s top five recommended varieties. Possibly a virginiana X kaki hybrid.
‘Slate’ and ‘Geneva Pumpkin’ grown by Hank and Nghi Frehtling in Willianston, MI.
‘Prok’ grown by Marc Boone in Ann Arbor, MI. Multiple years we’ve noted this variety for having large and firm fruit (when ripe). Flavor has been very mild in taste tests, borderline bland.
C-100 from the Claypool breeding program grown by Bill Nash of Nash Nurseries in Owosso, MI.
In seedling large populations it is not uncommon to find individuals who sport blue fruit…this coloration is only skin deep and this is NOT the cultivar ‘Blue’; seedling tree grown by Ken Asmus of Oikos Tree Crops.
Visit the Link/Resources page to find nursery sources for persimmon trees. Contact me if you’re growing American persimmons in MI.
REFERENCES:
-
“Story of James Claypool.” http://www.nutgrowers.org/persimmon.htm. N.p., n.d. Web. 22 Feb. 2014.
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“Michigan Nut Growers Association.” Www.michigannutgrowers.com. N.p., n.d. Web. 22 Feb. 2014.
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“Persimmon Pudding.” Ed to Growing, Education, A: Dedicatnd Use of Diospyros Virginiana L., the Common, or American Persimmon. N.p., n.d. Web. 22 Feb. 2014.
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“Exotické Rostliny, Zdeněk Černoch, Větřkovice U Vítkova.” Diospyros Virginiana. N.p., n.d. Web. 01 Mar. 2014.
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Reich, Lee, and Lee Reich. Uncommon Fruits for Every Garden. Portland: Timber, 2004.
"
According to Home Garden Persimmons | UGA Cooperative Extension
| Variety | Characteristics |
|---|---|
| Even Golden | Productive, with medium sized fruit containing 3-8 seeds. Excellent quality and firmness. |
| John Rick | Productive, excellent flavor and firmness with 2-8 seeds. |
| Woolbright | Excellent flavor but soft and splits easily; productive. |
| Miller | Productive, flavor good with large firm fruit. |
| Killen | Good flavor and firm fruit. Medium sized and moderately productive. |
According to Jerry Lehman in 2011 when he was alive he sent the following [NAFEX] Apple Scions, plus
"still have the following persimmon:
WS8-10, Owen seedless, Jim Claypool Early Golden (JCEG), C-100, H-65A,
I-93A, Morris Burton, H-118, 100-29N, 100-29S, 100-42, 100-45, 100-46, 100-47,
Knightsville.
Also Pounds Pecan, MacAllister Hican (several spellings of this one), Oran
Barton carpathian (large Hardy English walnut). Oran Barton is very winter
hardy in central Indiana as the ortet is over 100 years old.
Send $5.00 for snail mail shipment, $10.00 for priority mail, for 5
varieties or less pieces, as long as supplies last to cover postage and handling
to:
Jerry Lehman
7780 Persimmon St.
Terre Haute, IN 47802-4994
Persimmon descriptions:
Please note: This is not intended to be complete by any stretch of the
imagination. Neither scientific. It is a guide line only.
H-118 Very Early, large, soft, Lehman testing in orchard situation.
I-93A Lena x JCEG. Early, large, clear pulp, average taste.
U-20A D-128 x F-58. Late, very large, dull orange, good, pulps nicely
WS-8-10 VVLarge (some 86 Gr.), D-128 x F-58, mid to late, black material
19-10 Juhl x F-100. Mid to late, good producer, Avg size, good
tasting, vigorous.
100-29S Late, produces heavly, good for wildlife and deer.
100-29N Late, produces large crops of average size fruit, for wildlife.
100-42 B-59 x G-62. Mid season, Large, nice color, good flavor, soft.
100-45 B-59 x G-62. Mid season, avg to large, red blush, golden pulp,
jucy.
100-46 B-59 x G-62 .Mid to late, large, pretty red blush, sweet, exc.
taste.
100-47 B-59 x G-62. Mid season, orange, avg to large, wild life.
JCEG Many people may not have true Early Golden. This variety may
be mixed up. Lehman is using JCEG to designate the material
he has, traceable to the ortet. Lehman judges it still
as one of the best tasting compared to varieties available
today, it is mid season, avg size.
Knightsville, Mid season, very large, red blush, soft, sweet, gd taste,
origanted at Knightsville, IN.
Owen Seedless No description except seedless in some areas.
I’m often asked which is the best tasting. Taste is subjective. What may be
best for my self, others may not judge as best. If it isn’t good here in
Indiana it isn’t distributed"
Considering a wholesale order from Products | Rising Creek Nursery which is why i was checking on opinions of these varieties. There are many newer types at @KYnuttrees http://www.nuttrees.net/
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H118 is tops. My favorite American persimmon.
Morris Burton was small and mealy.
H63a is also excellent but milder flavor than H118.
Of course we have an unusual climate compared with the rest of North America.
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In my opinion the classics are often overlooked. I have Meader, Yates, and other classics. Although smaller they have great taste. @ramv our taste preferences seem to be pretty aligned and therefore I have H118 on the way. The pics put it over the top. Why would anyone not want the persimmon flavor at maximum intensity.
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