Yes, one needs to be diligent about rubbing off rootstock growth every couple of days. The rootstock normally gives up once the graft has a couple inches of strong growth. Looks like I’ll have at least 1 of most varieties I tried grafting this year. I’m never so optimistic with persimmons so I made 2-3 of everything.
I am used to rubbing offrootstock growths with all grafts I’ve done. I have to say persimmon rootstocks are darn persistent. The growths keep coming back so often.
That’s what I did last year and then had 12 of them to find homes for later! It’s like there are rules you need to follow like temperatures and rootstock growth but then they offer you nice straight wood and determination to grow. I have much better luck with persimmons than I do jujubes. @mamuang puts me to shame grafting jujubes. I suck at jujube grafting!!!
I guess it’s beginner’s luck with my jujubes. They took 100% with no aftercare other than aluminum foil heat shields. They were only hard in that the wood is impossible to cut.
Junebugs and persimmon psylla keep trying to eat my new grafts!
@k8tpayaso I ended up giving away my extra persimmon grafts from last year to my friends’ parents. They love eating persimmons.
I’ve had a lot of insect pressure too. Some are budding back out but I can’t find a way en mass to prevent it. I tried neem but the psylla laughed at that. Got my sevin out and just before spraying found a baby walking stick and figured there were more so I just couldn’t.
I have not been able to get any of my friends or family to take persimmon. One girl at work loves them but she said she’s not going to plant a tree! I may have to look harder because I certainly didn’t have problems on FB finding people that wanted them.
I think I got lucky because I grafted on established trees. My 6 grafts this year all took, too.
You’ve grafted on rootstock in pots, right? I think those young rootstocks may have been busy trying to establish their roots and do not have enough energy to push growth.
I’ve done both. 50% takes on both. I do blame some of my potted rootstock though…not because of roots but because they are small and have knarly trunks. I’ve gotta blame something!!! Lol. I think I’m having difficulty matching cambium…duh…of course. But I just think I’m not seeing it right or something. My takes are growing fabulously well though…well, except one of them and I’m not sure I’m counting it as a take…
The ones in the trash cans are the rootstock you sent me. They are growing good. Only one graft has given me trouble but thats because i didnt notice the new growth beneath the graft. The scion is still green so i think it still has a chance.
The small pots are rootstock from Ky division of forestry that i had to grow out a extra year to graft and some are still too small.
The varieties are.
3 Nakitas Gift
2 Saijo (possibly 3)
@8bdeepsand some of the grafts i did with your scions.
Looking great!!! Thanks for sharing. I’ve had good luck with the ones I grafted too. There were two that failed and I blamed it on the rootstock—well, you have to blame it on something!!!
I’m definitely at 248 successful however, I have more to pot up continuing on presently and those that will pop. Nuts are still gonna be at 40% (complete guess, really) of the Genus: Carya. Walnut still at pretty much zero. This is all bench-grafting of persimmon, pawpaw, and Carya and Juglans . . .
persimmon are simple. I think I’ll stick with them and do some evaluating and abandonment of nut trees however certain cultivars must and should be continued, always, naturally & of course.
So, I’m really tired. It’s been 6 months + at this… lots of building with a fortunate winter for zone 5b. I think the lowest on record. etc. etc.
P.s. pears are simple; persimmon super-easy; pawpaw probably 75% if you’re paying attention (still of course bench grafting.) And I want to mention it makes a big difference to be able to cut wood from your own trees completely fresh. A big, big difference… it doesn’t matter what you’re grafting.
Bleeding (after I drilled and bleeding stopped) so I removed this scion. It was more than two weeks old as a bark graft. The rootstock didn’t begin bleeding after drilling, waiting 2-days - then grafting, then appx. 9-12 days after it began bleeding again. That’s the clear liquid ya see.
Cambial activity is most active the last week of May and is the best time to be bark grafting but you can continue to graft so long as the bark keeps slipping which should be ending in the next 2-3 weeks (sometime mid-late July). Another pecan I grafted 40’ from this one didn’t bleed again. I’m looking at a plump bud having pushed thru the tape.
If you look closely, all I did was peel the bark down on the rootstock; make a long, flat cut on the scion (it was a short “piece” unfortunately"); flip the scion over and shave the bark away along the top and about 1mm wide off the bottom edge that runs along the first cut. Those pictures came out clear enough to show much of this.
Update on my grafts, antonovka rootstocks bench grafted and planted on 4/26. 6 weeks and today side by side comparison photos.
St. Edmunds Russet
This one was slow to start but has exploded over the last few weeks.
Flower of Kent
Sat idle after popping for several weeks but has put on good growth recently.
Didn’t pop for 5.5 weeks until I snipped off the terminal bud that was intact on the scion. Could be coincidence, not sure.
Was second to last to show any signs of a take…but after 6.5 weeks it awoke with a vengeance.
Strong growth so far.
One of the strongest growers at 6 weeks.
Then the leaves turned black at the tips and fell off…
Probably overwatering (it was planted at the low, slower draining side of the orchard)
It is now pushing some new growth, we shall see…
Was really worried this one wouldn’t take, it sat for close to 8 weeks with no signs of popping…so I snipped the 5 bud scion back to 2 buds out of desperation…it was still plenty green inside. A matter of days later it started pushing growth… Coincidence?
This one popped…sat idle for a few weeks and then was chewed to bits by a gypsy moth caterpillar… doesn’t look good for this one, hasn’t pushed any new growth since.
Overall pretty happy with the progress!
Looks like four or five of those are ready for you to choose which shoots will become whips, and which shoots will be removed. I think the sooner you are able to make that commitment, the more they will appreciate it…and the more they will grow this year.
Thank you for the reminder
And you need stakes my good grafter, friend. Birds
There actually are some just out of frame (these shots are fairly close up). Always a good idea for sure.
Here is my update. This Spring, I started grafting for my long term plan to have a mini-orchard of mini-trees. Onto either Bud-9 or Geneva 222 rootstocks, I grafted apples Gravenstein, Winter Banana, Black Oxford, Jonared, Porter, Jonagold, Beni Shogun Fuji, SummerRed, and Liberty. Those were whip-and-tongue, using 1/2 inch wide strips cut from Zip Lock freezer bags as binding.
I also did a cleft graft of Pristine onto Geneva 222. That was tiny, too small for me to do whip-and-tongue, so I did the cleft. I was trying to recover that. It was a remaining twig from a Pristine branch of a multigraft tree that failed and broke off after several years of growth.
I also grafted a bartlet-like pear onto various rootstocks, varieties of Service Berry, Aronia, and Haw.
Onto my Marissard seedling chestnut, I did whip-and-tongue grafts of Marivale, Precose Migoule, and Marigoule.
Last week, I unwrapped all of the apple graft bindings. Here are some of the young trees.
A couple of graft close ups.
The Pristine grew about a foot, but when I unwrapped it, it just feel off. Almost no callous. I wonder if this scion has a virus infection, since the original was a delayed graft failure. Or just too small of a contact area for this to hold together. Or maybe just my poor grafting technique.
For the pears, only the one on Chinese Haw seems to have taken (I forgot to photograph). The ones on Serviceberry grew about an inch, then died. The one on Black Hawthorne and Aronia did not grow at all. Neither did the one on Winter Banana interstem on Bud 9.
For the chestnuts, they all grew lush, about a foot to 18 inches. I took the wrapping off from two.
The Marigoule had grown lush new growth, and bloomed profusely. When I unwrapped it, it just fell off. Apparently the graft was tight enough for transfer of nutrients but no callous formation.
The Marivale looks better. It has grown nicely and held together so far.
I know that chestnuts can have issues with graft failure, so I’m not all that surprised that at least one has failed. I may send for some mail order scion next year, see what happens with those.
Finally, three weeks ago I re-grafted my leaf curl resistant seedling peach tree (I re-designated it “Sunny Day”) onto Lovell. The original whip and tongue grafts did not take. I kept the rootstocks growing, and when cambium was slipping in June, did patch grafts. I also did the same thing with a feral black cherry, found on my dog walking along the country road. The cherries are the size of Montmorency, have a black cherry flavor, and quite sweet. So I patch grafted two buds onto my Sure-Fire cherry tree, same technique. Those also seem to be taking.
So that’s my grafting this year. I’m happy about the apples that took, not too surprised about the pear on odd rootstock failures, interested in the chestnuts and how they will do with time, and glad I’m finally able to propagate my “Sunny Day” peach, which is the only peach I’ve had out of many, that seems truly resistant to leaf curl and continues to produce peaches, but is in a bad location. Propagating it means I can plant it into a better spot and maybe even share a tree.
They look pretty good. At three weeks, the buds are still alive.
This is that peach patch graft. I have not unwrapped it yet.
Your first whip and tongue looks spot on. Often I see demo pictures that don’t look nearly so well done.
Thanks Jafar. I learned at HOS, about 8 years ago.
Then I’m prejudiced, I was probably assisting teach that class