Can American persimmons be grown in containers? Has anyone had success doing this? I’ve seen some discussions on growing Asian persimmons in pots, but my understanding is that American persimmons have a tap root and that could be an issue.
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Yes.
I usually grow them in containers until they prove they’re worthy of a spot. If not, they get culled.
Their production will lower than in ground.
Tap roots aren’t a problem. Just cut them off
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Typically, discussion on Asian persimmons in pots is due to challenges with cold hardiness. Plus they are naturally a smaller tree than what virginiana has the capacity to achieve.
I will have at least three or four kaki varieties in pots along with my figs on the deck starting this year.
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Do you mind describing how you care for your potted persimmons, container size, if they’ve fruited, etc? I have an IKKJ shipped to me and can’t decide whether or not to keep it in a pot or risk putting it in the ground (Zone 6b/7a).
Thanks @ramv ! Any recommendations for ideal container size? And do you use grow bags or air pot for air pruning effect?
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Larger is better. 10 gallon is a good compromise between size and moveability.
I’ve had very poor luck with fabric pots but others here report success.
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I have Ichi, Rojo, Nikita, and Tam Kam in 10 gal pots. Three have fruited for multiple years. The fruit is smaller and not as numerous but tastes great. I do it because of space and cold hardiness.
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you guys have pictures of your persimmons in pots by chance? also, how do you handle irrigation for your containers?
whats your potting medium and is it the same for all your potted plants? also, how do you handle irrigation for your containers?
I will be putting my kaki Persimmons in pots to grow for the first time this year. I typically go with a mix of pine bark chips, optisorb, locally collected sphagnum Moss, peat moss, a bit of silt or soil for minerals, and some perlite. I have found with my figs that having a mulch layer of sphagnum moss helps with moisture retention.
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Can a cypress be grown as a bonsai? Sure.
I get @ramv’s suggestion that we can grow them in a pot until they prove their worth. But an American persimmon wants to be a 60’ tree. It seems to me that we’ll be fighting the tree’s nature trying to grow it in a pot. I’m sure it could be done, with severe annual pruning of both top growth and roots. But it seems far from ideal.
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For some reason, American persimmons don’t want to be 60’ trees here. I find them to be rather dwarfed. And I have a few in ground too and they are my slowest growing. Pawpaws outgrow them each year by 2x. I do no pruning on them but they seem to self prune each year.
Other growers in the PNW have reported the same thing.
Kakis are fastest growing followed by hybrids which are sort of in-between.
OK, so maybe a pot is appropriate for DV in the PNW. But we know from looking at wild trees that DV in the Midwest and Northeast U.S. grow to enormous size. Until we understand the different performance, we should be cautious about generalizations.
My “Prok” DV planted in the ground here in RI grew to 20’ within 5-6 years. Its branches now grow 6-8’ annually. If I didn’t prune aggressively, it would quickly reach 30-40’. Admittedly, it takes a few years before these trees really take off. But they are not inherently small trees.
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Meanwhile my Prok has just about filled out a 5 gallon pot in 5 years. Yes, severely neglected.
I would encourage the OP to consider lotus as a rootstock as it has a more fibrous root system and suckers a lot less.
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@jrd51 wow - yes, that’s what I’m worried about, but also one of the main reasons I want to try a container if it is at all feasible. I’m not necessarily ready to commit to a 60±foot, long-lived, heavily-fruiting tree in my yard right now. But to @ramv 's earlier point, if I could get a couple years of fruiting in a container before it becomes too hard to contain, that would help me evaluate whether I really want to commit to it and find a permanent spot for it. But if it will be so immediately unhappy in the container that it doesn’t do well and never fruits, that wouldn’t be helpful. I think I will give it a try and can report back on my experience here in New Jersey.
@ramv thank you for the rec of D. lotus rootstock - will have to see if I can find it. I have a local nursery that sells virgiana seedlings, so was going to try grafting to one of those.
I didn’t mean to imply either that (1) a pot could not be a good short-term option, or (2) a in-ground tree could not be managed to a lower height, say 20’. To the contrary . . . .
Pot: I think a grafted DV variety on DV rootstock would take 3-5 years before outgrowing a 20 g pot. My 6 inground DV’s grafted in 2022 are roughly 7’ tall and 4’ wide, after modest annual pruning. For this initial ~3 year period, I think they’d be OK in a pot. But I expect them to take off this year. Grown in a pot, they’d be screaming now for a transplant.
Ground: Based on my experienced with the purchased “Prok” tree, I think an in-ground tree that is already 3 years old when planted will grow quickly. But it could be kept under 20’ by heading the central leader at 4-6’, forcing the growth of numerous scaffolds, and diligently removing / heading ALL vertical growth. In other words, make it grow out rather than up. You just shouldn’t underestimate the work required to force a tree that wants to be upright to spread out.
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You basically want water retention, aeration, and mineral/organic matter but you might change the recipe based on your climate, your watering strategy, and what you’re growing. I wasn’t too exact with the persimmons and they seem to be fine.
The fig people have this generally dialed in…
4:2:1 is common - 4 parts peat (or coco coir) for water retention and soil substrate, 2 parts pine bark grounds (for aeration), 1 part perlite (for aeration), plus fertilizers and limestone to adjust pH
Some people also add compost, garden soil, and other things in small amounts for more nutrients. I live in a dry climate so I add more water retention elements (top soil and calcined clay, i.e. oil absorber).
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This is a good overview. I’d add that pine bark breaks down over time, becoming increasingly similar to the fine components (e.g., peat, coir). So personally I prefer calcined clay and diatomaceous earth for aeration, though both retain water quite well too. You could also add coarse sand (except it is biologically neutral and heavy), crushed shells, pumice, or similar.
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There is no way any tree is going to grow 60’ (or 40’ or even 20’ within a short period) Every tree can be kept and maintained easily in a pot with 2 year root pruning.
As far as potting medium goes, persimmon are very forgiving. Figs are far less so.
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