They were awesome.
JohN S
PDX OR
2 Likes
Glad to hear you like it.
I really want to try Garretson. I am still waiting for my numerous rootstocks to get big enough for graftingā¦
When I first started growing Am persimmons, like the nerd that I am, I studied all the Claypool research and found that the best flavor was often not only from the female tree but from the male as well. I bought and grafted Szukis from the late John Gordon, and it pollinates my Garretson. My Early Golden often has unseeded fruit. I wonder if the flavor is not quite as rich because it isnāt pollinated at all or because the Szukis complements the flavor of the Garretson, but not the Early Golden. Author Lee Reich has listed Garretson as one of his very favorites.
John S
PDX OR
1 Like
Hereās a great, highly-informative article on persimmons with a lot of valuable nuggets:
Persimmons Can Offer Growers an Additional Revenue Stream
Deborah Jeanne Sergeant New York Correspondent Apr 8, 2016
SENECA FALLS, N.Y. ā Jerry Lehman, who has spent 25 years developing a commercially viable persimmon tree for U.S. growers, shared his research with attendees of a recent āRare Fruit Workshop,ā put on by Cornell Cooperative Extension in Seneca Falls.
The Terre Haute, Ind., native told the two-dozen attendees how he learned about persimmons. After retirement, he wanted to get back to his farming roots.
Lehman said he first explored apples, but felt he wanted to grow something more unusual. Then he met Jim Claypool, known as the worldās most prolific persimmon grower, who collected and bred all 2,400 known varieties of persimmons. Lehman never looked back. He helped Claypool in his persimmon breeding efforts and tried to learn all he could from his mentor.
Claypool has since died, but Lehman carries on his legacy and shares their knowledge of persimmons as often and widely as he can.
Of the two main types of persimmons ā 60 chromosome (60c) and 90 chromosome (90c) ā Lehman recommends 90c for its larger fruit size ā up to 2.25 inches in diameter ā greater sweetness, fluid pulp and earlier ripening. Theyāre also parthenocarpic, unlike 60c which require fertilization to grow fruit.
By contrast, 60c persimmons ripen later, after frost, which can make them ill-suited for growing in the Northeast. The fruit grows to only 1 inch in diameter.
Growers cannot cross-pollinate 60c and 90c persimmons.
Lehman said growers can tell the difference between male and female trees by looking for one flower or, during winter, pedicel per stem for male trees and three per stem for female trees.
āBees are excellent pollinators for persimmons, but most varieties donāt need pollination,ā Lehman said.
Saplings may be planted 8 to 10 inches deep.
āPersimmons are not choosy about soil type," he said. "It is necessary to have nitrogen on persimmons Iām beginning to believe, though I havenāt performed tests on it.ā
Lehman uses rotted wood chips and commercial fertilizer. The fruit matures in late fall. Many people believe that frost must precede persimmon harvest, but Lehman said new varieties are ripe before frost, which can make it possible for Northern growers to add persimmons to their farms.
To prevent his ripe fruit from dropping on the ground, Lehman said he constructs safety nets by building a PVC pipe frame and stretching landscape cloth on it. Though the safety net also collects bird droppings and can suffer damage from deer, he said he appreciates the amount of fruit it saves.
To clean the fruit, he fills a laundry basket with fruit and lowers it into a larger container. It holds a solution of one tablespoon of bleach per gallon of water. After soaking the fruit a few minutes, he removes the laundry basket and rinses the fruit.
Many people like making persimmon sauce as an end product. Since persimmons donāt store long-term, saucing them can allow growers to offer customers a value-added product with shelf life.
Smaller operations can get by with kitchen-scale applesauce-making equipment, such as a Squeezo food mill.
Some growers may wonder if investing in persimmons is worth it if thereās no market, but Lehman said thatās backwards thinking.
āYou canāt market a product if you donāt have a supply,ā he said.
He added that numerous people, including the late Col. Harland Sanders, KFCās founder, considered using persimmons but could find no adequate source of the fruit.
āPass out samples and educate the public at your farmers market,ā he said.
Lehman said persimmons graft easily and donāt leave an open wound long. Any damage to the ground-level bark, however, can severely damage and even kill the trees, so growers must carefully mow and trim weeds among the trees.
Grafting side branches doesnāt work well because they donāt receive full sun. Lehman recalled his mentor, Claypool, grafting side branches on numerous trees only to see them drop off. The lack of sunlight caused the grafting failure, he said.
Lehman said growers planting persimmon seeds should insert the seed into the soil 8 inches apart with the āeyeā of the seed upward. The eye is the rounded end that has a slight opening.
āIf youāre planting 1,000 seeds in a nursery, you may not want to take the time to look,ā he said.
After six weeks, the persimmon seeds sprout, a trait which has confused seed buyers who thought Lehman had sent them home with duds.
Persimmon pests include twig girdlers, which cut slots in twig bark, lay seeds in them, chew the twigs until they fall off and allow eggs to incubate on the ground. Growers should pick up and destroy any fallen twigs under trees to interrupt the twig girdler life cycle.
āIt can be very devastating if you have a large number of trees,ā he said.
The persimmon bore larva also chews into the tree, causing bark damage. Lehman said knocking off and destroying any structures built by the insects helps control them along with spraying and filling in their holes with tree wound sealer.
Tent worms also plague persimmon trees by eating their leaves. Lehman said to pull off their spider web-like structures and stomp on them.
Fungus can also affect persimmon treesā leaves, turning the veins dark. He said that fungus spreads quickly on a persimmonās leaves and oftentimes on leaves the following year. But it doesnāt seem to harm the tree permanently, he said, just its harvest by splitting the fruitās skin.
He hasnāt used spray for fungus, but said apple tree spray would likely work for persimmons.
His favorite varieties of persimmons are H63A, Dollywood and H91A for their production and fruit quality. Cold-hardy, early harvest varieties can help Northeastern growers succeed in growing persimmons.
Deborah Jeanne Sergeant is a freelance writer in central New York. Connect with her online at www.skilledquill.net.
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These are all large and tasty: Prok,
H-118, and 100-46.
2 Likes
What kind do you have Susu and when did you plant it? I bought one from Dax, 100-42 a few weeks ago and it hasnāt started growing just yet. Definitely alive though.
I planted it last spring. It was just a little seedling last year but grew more than 4 ft. Not sure what variety it is. I got it from Schlabachs nursery. They donāt sell grafted varieties in the catalog. I placed an order for some other stuff and just asked if they happen to have persimmon. They had this unknown American persimmon so I bought one.
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My Prok persimmon I planted last year is breaking bud in Lancaster, PA. Seems a bit early for persimmons but this has been a weird spring for us.
How low do most people let their persimmons start to branch? This thing is currently a 4ā whip but has buds opening from top to bottom.
@Susu have you considered grafting a known variety to yours? It might not give you fruit if it turns out to be a male tree.
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I topped my Prok off at 4 feet and let it branched out at that height for easy mowing. The tree is eight years old and at 18 feet tall and about 10 feet wide.
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Yes Iām going to graft to it once it starts to grow. This is my first after-winter with persimmon. From what Iāve read I was expecting it to leaf out later than this.
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@tonyOmahaz5 you must have persimmons out the wazoo with a tree that size! Iāll probably let mine grow tall to make a small shade tree.
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3 people so far this year have said Prok was leafing out early, mine included. My prok leafed out before some kakis did and about a full 3 weeks before any other American.
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Iāve grafted Prok in two different places. One is early this year and the other is very average.
Question: So obviously, American (Diospyros virginiana) & Asian (Diospyros kaki) Persimmons can cross-pollinate and hybridizeā¦
But, what about Texas Persimmons (Diospyros texana)? Can they also cross-pollinate and even hybridize with either of those, too?
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Virginiana and Kaki cannot cross pollinate and hybridize. It took many years and lots of experiments before just a handful of F1 hybrids were created. I am only aware of 2
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Seeing this thread reminds me of one of my favorite public parks in the DC area, with many large persimmon trees along the trail, the Rachel Carson Conservation Park:
The main row of trees looked like they had been planted at some point, but the field includes many younger trees that are likely seedlings of those.
Definitely worth a visit during persimmon season for anyone in the area with an interest.
Iām working on this, my texanas are only seedlings, but apparently only approach grafting works. Iāll be trying to get hachiya x texana asap (sooooo 4 years).
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Yes, PharmerDrewee,
Tony has had this terrible problem for a very long time. He is exceptionally skilled at growing fruit, so he has to figure out some way to harvest and eat all of it. I feel very sorry for him. 
John S
PDX OR
4 Likes
If they cannot hybridize, then how was it done?
Wow, that would be one fascinating hybrid if possible! How exactly are you attempting to do this?