@Carld Do you what I would give for a cup of gelsi neri? I grew up on a farm in Italy and they were my absolute absolute absolute favorite thing to eat of all time! Too bad they don’t do well in z6. I’m hoping Oscar or Kokuso comes close. Planting those in ground next spring.
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Aren’t they the same or really close? I have something from Thailand with hairy fruits, which heavily resemble both.
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A question for the group- im not a mulberry expert by any means and always learning…
I stuck 20 cuttings in March/April of this year. Every cutting took and grew leaves and some even fruited a little. All cuttings were from the same tree at the same time and all are in the same location.
I have had at least 3 decent frosts and all but 1 have went totally dormant. The others went dormant weeks ago.
Out of 20 there is 1 that looks as if its the middle of the summer…not even a hint of harm from frost.
Normal? is this one a male or female or something that makes it different? Or is it tougher or something? Curious to me.
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Now that’s a list to be proud of.
I am in 10a.
Trees in ground:
Bryce’s WB
Aus Green
Tice
Black Paki
Thai Mustang (not sure what this is but I have it)
Dwarf Thai
Pots: (eventually will be planted)
Honeydrops
White pakistan
Austurkey
“Red Himalayan FSP” on 6th street rootstock
“Green Aus FSP” on 6th street rootstock
Sweet Rose
Just grafted:
Red Himalayan from Kaz
Green austr from Jan
I just got a bunch of cuttings to root from Jan Doolin and they are fabulous. Almost all rooted. Maui, JWB, Lakeland tropical, Valdosta.
Nice to finally have some success after trying and failing miserably with citrus a decade ago. Mangos and Mulberries are the way to go.
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Fruittreeaddict (Jan Doolin) has cuttings for sale on figbid. FYI
Is red Himalayan the same as red shahtoot?
Well, was it too good to be true or is Black Prince a winner? I gather it’s grown in the same areas as Shelli and Gaylitzia, so hopefully it’s pretty hardy and not too low-chill. The fruit LOOKS amazing. I’d love to get ahold of a stick if it’s actually working for you. Sounds like it can be hard to get ahold of, and there may be many different varieties circulating under the name. I have several other varieties you might be interested in: Shelli (150?), Gaylitzia, Plodovaya, Ukranian Giant. Paradise is a pretty good lavender fruit type to. I got if from GRIN but i think it came from someone in CRFGA. It does just fine up here in VT. Funny how wide a range of adaptability some varieties have.
Cheers,
-Devin
Rockingham, VT
I put in a plain old morus rubra, the native mulberry, today. I’ve got one of the standard kinds (alba crosses I assume) growing pretty big from a few years ago that’s never bloomed or produced- and a very small one I planted from bare root last year.
the house I grew up in had rubra all over the place, and even though it’s not the most sought after berry, it’s a nostalgic flavor for me. I’m hoping it grows well here. I put it near, but not shaded by, my hazelnuts.
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I’m growing a supposed cold hardy morus nigra from Oikos tree crops.
We will see.
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I could never find a Morus Rubra that was named. Many pure Rubra are just seedlings from nursery. Some argue Illinois Everbearing is a pure Rubra and some argue it is a hybrid but I could find few named and the named varieties I am unaware where to find them.
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There used to be a handful of rubra cultivars in circulation. Few if any seem to be extant. I think AJ Downing may have listed them perhaps? In any case, they would have been cultivars circa 1900 perhaps, nothing sold commercially in the post-war era of mail order, etc. The only contemporary list I’ve found is in Lee Reich’s “Uncommon Fruits…”
Rubras grew quite well in spots near where I grew up on the Navesink River in NJ. The mucky silt loam above the brackish water floodplains must have really suited them. I haven’t been back in a looong time, but wonder if they are still doing well, or if those areas have been developed or overrun by aggressive exotics. I remember really enjoying the fruit as a youth, and wondering why others didn’t seem to like them and looked askance at the notion of eating them. They fruit were large, from my recollection, perhaps not as big as my IE fruits, but nearly. And they had a meaty texture and vinuous richness compared to the typical alba watery sweetness. If anyone on the list is from that neck of the woods, I’d gladly tell you where to look if you’d promise to send me a stick or two of dormant wood.
I went onto mulberry.org and they have a list. Thing is their list of mulberry claim they are either not totally morus rubra or are not the best in some way. Hick’s Everbearing, Illinois Everbearing, Stubbs, Varaha are all listed under red but are listed as hybrids of red in the description. Johnson is listed with large fruit but not prolific. They list Travis but claim they do not know a nursery selling it. Then they have wild type which just seems to be a wild mulberry. Maybe there is a reason they are not selling Rubra who knows. I am not by NJ so cannot look for it. Mulberry grow well everywhere though. I have read people sprayed herbicides, cut the mulberry down etc. at they still keep on growing. Mulberry grow so well they are almost an invasive weed assuming you have the zone. They are kind of like a bramble in that sense. Typically the difference between a cultivar and a wild variety is they were chosen for traits like taste, fruit size, disease resistance (likely factors of other fruit than mulberry) etc.
Not sure where you are located, but Youre description matches the traits of Morus alba and it’s hybrids very well, but the “true” Morus rubra is far more fickle. Where it grows, it may do well, but it is not a generalist by any means. The issue with the hybrids, is that they purportedly express alba traits in abundance. I’m not sure I agree 100% with this characterization, nor do I think it’s logistically practical to eliminate albas or prevent their crossing. The pure rubras are definitely distinct, though. You might check this short white paper out as starting point if you’re curious about rubras in particular.
If you mainly want quality fruit that’s easy to grow, it doesn’t really matter exactly what it’s taxonomy is. But if you’re interested for purposes of breeding, conservation, ecology, etc. there’s definitely a distinction to be made.
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how does Jan’s Best do in your zone?
I have two Jan’s Best that I rooted last year I plan to plant them in ground next year. Im in zone 6B West Virginia
You may need to consider growing it in a container or greenhouse. I have Worlds Best here, which sounds to be along similar lines. Hardiness is an issue, but low chill is the main deal breaker. Maybe growing as a dieback perennial is workable in some marginal spots. I’m thinking I may try the worlds best in a high tunnel with protection. If I can keep it dormant, it may be worthwhile, or maybe a total folly. I’m in “zone 5”- not that that’s a real place per se.
Here’s my evaluation so far (all grafted on Pak mulberry)
Black Pakistan - sugar cube. If you let it ripen longer it does develop mild additional flavors. Worth the spot
White Pakistan - even milder than Black Pakistan. You can convince yourself it has a melon/honey flavor. My wife and kids like it a lot
Four Seasons - It does produce 4 crops. I don’t even bother picking the first one. 2nd and 3rd are ok and fourth is not good.
Illinois Everbearing - this might be wrongly labeled. Super vigorous even on Pakistan tree. Not great flavor. Removed
Oscar - decent flavor but small size. Doesn’t add anything beyond Black Pakistan
Hunza White seedless - white mulberry. Needs more evaluation. So far, inferior to White Pakistan in size and similar in flavor
Easter egg - needs more time for evaluation
DMOR9/Himalayan - Very similar to Black Pakistan in size and flavor. More productive and more vigorous. Does get affected by late frosts even in coastal z9b. Can’t decide if it merits a spot if you already have Black Pak
Thompson - needs more time
Shangri La - finally a mulberry with some balanced flavor. Excellent. Unfortunately, the graft died
So far, if you have Black Pakistan and Shangri La, you’re not missing much.
Morus Nigra - Noir de Spain (planted as separate tree) - best of all mulberries. Unfortunately, doesn’t fruit much so far
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How large is your Oikos (nigra)? Mine is probably about 4 feet tall and this year my plan is to put it into the ground.
Is yours planted in the ground yet?
Scott
I’m in a good zone 6(b) area and Worlds Best survives for me with minimal dieback, but the fruit is disappointing enough that I am grafting it over to Gerardi this spring.
Scott
Hello, Mine has been in the ground for 2-3 years I think. It’s maybe 5 feet tall. Very slow growing. I actually have 2 of them.
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have they fruited for you?
Mine has been potted for a couple years. It is pretty slow growing
Scott