You are assuming someone lives in a warmer area. I have Black Pakistan growing in the garage and it seemed to survive. Growing it outside would be impossible though. Same with Shangri la. If I grow a mulberry outside it needs to be something like an Illinois Everbearing or a Girardi is zone 5.
Mine has not fruited yet.
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Exactly right. My use of “you” could be confusing above. This is evaluation in my area and not for everyone. I guess thats true for every report in this site. I know many like IE in the east.
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Well that’s promising anyway. How long has it been growing? I watched a YouTube video of a woman who grows Worlds Best and she said she very nearly removed it because it had been so bland for her, but then around year 3 or so the flavor started to get much better. I noticed a similar thing with Oscar’s. It was good, not great for 3-4 years and then last year the flavor improved dramatically. The fruit were also quite a bit larger.
I for one have been pretty disappointed with Gerardi. The fruit is beautiful and the season is long, but the Brix and richness of flavor just aren’t there so far. I’m not short on room, so I don’t mind waiting and hopefully I’ll change my mind at some point. I’ve heard others describe it as excellent.
You don’t have Thai Dwarf/World’s Best? Your missing out, should graft a few scionwood on your Black Pakistan. See below, I will post some fruit photos for you now.
Illinois everbearing is inferior to Silk Hope in this area. SH is likely hardy in the same zones as IE and should be grown more. I sometimes even prefer it to Morus Nigra.
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My Thai Dwarf (aka World’s Best), I have both of them grafted on same tree, they are the same.
Just picked 1 lb of fruit today, it should continue to ripen for the next 4 wks with 1 lb of fruit each day ripening.
It’s not really sweet, but kids love to pick them.
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It’s so funny and mysterious how/why mulberry varieties can perform so differently from site to site. For context, How old and large are you’re trees? What’s you’re soil like? pH? Just curious.
I had Pakistan or Himalayan and Shangri La atFruit and Spice Park in Homestead, FL, and they were exceptional. Maybe heat is lacking at your coastal location to develop flavor or Brix?
IE is very good here. Fruit is often approaching 2” long x 5/8”. I have several of the DMOR accessions selected in NYC, including Easter Egg. Also have Big Red, Long White, and DMOR 90, which I’m not sure has a common “cultivar” name yet. Knowing that fruit quality is often not up to par the first few years, I’m inclined to give them a chance, but I’ve found them pretty measly so far. Easter egg is supposed to be in the large side, but all seem quite small for me so far. I’ve yet to write home about the flavor either. They all seem like sidewalk tramps to me, which I guess they are.
The descriptions on GRIN were hilarious. Things like “found growing on small strip of soil of on-ramp of the Hutchinson Parkway. Probably some tough ones there, not sure there’s much else to recommend them. Happy to know otherwise though.
I grafted some DMOR9 macroura partly based on the narrative on the USDA GRIN site. It’s a little blurb from Seed Saver’s Exchange suggesting it is adaptable into zone 5. I didn’t really think that was likely but had to try. It’s in a container and I’m toying with how best to grow it, if at all. I may try it as a container tree for a time. It’s pretty vigorous. I had thought of using it for breeding, but I’m not sure ploidy is very compatible. Worlds Best and Gerardi have both been claimed as alba x macroura hybrids. I dunno. @Richard ? I was told Ted Danieki (not sure if he’s on the forum?) was working on hybridizing the two. I was given a stick of a purported seedling cross, but it was not viable (thin, winterkilled)
One that I grow which doesn’t seem to be in circulation much is Paradise. It’s also a USDA accession, and was donated by someone from CRFGA. Its a lavender type, plump and good size. A lot of lavender ones seem closer to white fruited types- dry texture, high brix but no acid or complexity of flavor. Paradise is more in the middle. It’s quite juicy and I find it quite tasty. It grows well here in Vermont and might be one to try in coastal Cali. It’s also reputedly a dwarf variety, but mine have been vigorous with loooooong internodes. Maybe it’s dwarfed through a different mechanism than Gerardi. It may spur up and stop growing when it hits a certain size? I don’t think I’ve come across anyone growing it yet, and everyone I mention it to has never heard of it.
Lots of new ones here to grow out and evaluate. I’m excited to try some of the ukranian ones I grafted last year- Shelli, Galicia, Plodovaya, Ukranian Giant. Doing some more new ones this year too. Still looking for ‘Black Prince’. I’d love to hear feedback on any of the above.
I also added Lawson Dawson and Corral last year. Hoping to graft Kip Parker this spring. I think there’s a stick waiting for me in a friend’s fridge.
I’m going to have a few mulberries to eat before long…
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I had girardi from Whitman farms. It fruited quickly and prolifically. It was busting with fruit first year. Issue is I had the same experience as you. The mulberry just tasted like sugar water to me. Many people claim it to be way better but I was not too impressed. Illinois Everbearing certainly grows farther north than silk hope. I believe Illinois Everbearing is hardy to zone 4 and Silk Hope is hardy to zone 6. That is a 20 degree difference in survival.
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I have Black Prince, if the graft grew enough, I wouldn’t mind trading a few cuttings for your Paradise.
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I’ll check tomorrow during the day if the Black Prince branch can be cut or not. I have not had fruits on it yet. Maybe it has some fruits now. I have 18 varieties so I don’t always check each one.
There were enough people dunking on Thai Dwarf (is it same as World’s Best?) here that I didn’t bother. Four Seasons is as productive as your pics for me and it produces 4 crops. It just doesn’t wow me.
That’s a big endorsement. I should try grafting Silk Hope next year.
I think my tree is 4 years old now and it was transplanted but didn’t bother it and very vigorous overall. My soil is Clay-Loam and alkaline. Pakistan is really sweet here but given the reviews I guess I expected more. I did say Shangri La is excellent here and both Black Pakistan and SL are worth the spot in my yard.
I read that as well, but the initial evidence doesn’t support it. Last year, I saw damage in the shoot tips when the temps dipped below 32F after they leafed out. Only this variety was affected. It’s possible, it doesn’t leaf out early in lower zones but I doubt it.
At least from the pics from @Richard and others who attended Wolfskill mulberry tasting, Easter Egg is not that big, especially compared to Black Pakistan. That matches the fruits on my graft last year as well.
I think I have Paradise grafted as well. Lets see how it does on my tree.
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Morus nigra is a heavy bearer. It just needs a long long time to get cranking
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This will be its 4th year I believe.
My favorites are IE (which I coppiced and it is now just coming back) and Kukoso. Both of these are over 10 years old. I also have Beautiful Day and it is better than WB, but not great. I also have Pakistan and a nigra in pots. The nigra is the best of the bunch
Maybe I’ll give it a chance as I pruned it pretty low after its 1st year and there are two main trunks coming up from about 8 inches from the ground.
I’m pretty tight on room as well
Scott
Looks like from a little bit of reading that macrouras are diploid or tetraploid. I guess if diploid alba and 22n nigra hybridize readily, then alba x macroura should be easy. The hard part appears to be preserving useful traits from macroura.
Maybe crossing diploid alba with tetraploid would be a useful avenue? Don’t triploids tend to exhibit increased size, productivity, etc. as a result of sterility?
What’s your system for managing these container mulberries (pot size, when do you set them out, where do you winter thin, etc)
How old are they each and what’s you’re approximate yield?
I have Gerardi dwarf now… grafted it last spring and it grew like crazy last season. 4 scions… 8 shoots 6+ ft long. Buds have opened now and it is loaded with fruit already.
Strudledog in north GA said his ripens fruit end of April… expext mine will ripen fruit early May.
He brags on the flavor of his sweet tart says it taste like IE.
It may require southern heat to be a better growing and tasting mulberry.
I will let you all know how it turns out here… I should be eating them in a month or less.
I also have a Silk Hope planted this spring… it is leafing now and as leaves appear… fruit also comes out with them. Not expecting first year fruit to be wow… but next year may be.
Have made up my mind on adding one other variety… that sure seems to do well in the south… big great tasting mulberries… Oscar.
I will show you why I think Oscar is going to be a very good tasting mulberry in the south…
Just watch this southern gal talking about and eating oscar mulberries. She has convinced me.
Love it 
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LOL – I’m glad to hear this as these are the two standard varieties I’m growing (with Gerardi). Kokuso is still very young.
I don’t need more fruit but I’m always on the lookout for a variety that will prove superior. I’m not aware of any variety that is consistently better than IE in the northeast. But I’m open to suggestions. . . .
I just re-read this entire thread. I’m intrigued by the endorsements of Silk Hope. It seems just barely cold hardy enough. One question: Does it ripen all at once? And if so, is it at all early or late? I have Illinois Everbearing and I really appreciate the gradual ripening over 6-8 weeks. I don’t know what I’d do with all those berries all at once.
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Silk hope has a long season. About 6-8 weeks.
It is much better flavored than Illinois Everbearing or Kokuso (which is getting replaced as it is my least favorite)
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