Hi, newbie here!
I am trying to choose a variety or two of blackberry (and/or loganberry, tayberry…) that will primarily be for fresh eating and will give me the best flavor in humid zone 6b (Bethesda, MD). For reference, Caroline is my favorite raspberry for flavor, and I tend to like a bit of tart along with sweet (so, for example, white peaches are not my thing because they’re too mild, but I love sweet yellow peaches).
After flavor, productivity, being more upright, and being thornless would be great bonuses (I have a toddler who would appreciate the lack of thorns!), but I am more than willing to put up with thorns for great flavor. I see @jtburton loves marionberry - do you all think marionberry might survive our winters if I grow it next to the house and cover?
I vote for Natchez. It’s a tarter berry and has all the traits you’re looking for. I’m in southern PA a little north of you. It’s extremely productive and early enough to mostly escape SWD.
Most of the Western trailing varieties, like Marionberry, struggle in temperatures that get below 15F or above 90F. They can survive by covering them but they will likely not produce much fruit. They are, in my opinion, the best tasting blackberry. If you want a variety that is dependable and easy to manage, try Osage. Triple crown is also very good but a bit more to manage and slightly less winter hardy.
Hi Jen, I am in Baltimore and can confirm what jburton said and I also agree with his two recommendations.
I tried maybe 30 different varieties and found the trailing ones were not happy at all when it got too hot. In principle I think they could be grown in the perfect microclimate but many would also need covering in the winter (I used to do that).
The USDA breeding program has been crossing western and eastern types recently and I am hopeful that they may eventually make one which we can grow. I have some of them now, e.g. Eclipse and Galaxy, and these are similar to Osage, but there are some newer ones which sound better as they are half trailing; the ones I have are only 1/4th.
Hey @jtburton have you tried this new one that is 50-50 which it sounds like they will be releasing? I forgot the exact number but its Orus 4XXX. It looks like it is only available wholesale now.
I’ll defer to other growers with more experience but I’m located in MD 6b as well (northern Baltimore County) and had a terrible experience with Natchez. It was very productive but the berries were very tart. I pruned according to the Natchez specific guidelines from the University of Arkansas and let the berries hang until dull in color, but they were still generally tart with an aftertaste. We grow Boyne Raspberries and Jewel Black Raspberries in the same general location and have been very pleased with both, but Natchez for whatever reason did not fair well.
Hey Scott. No, I have not tried these, primarily because I don’t have a good source for trial plants. I have 2 blackberry hybrids that I’m trying that were ‘bird-produced’, but I have low expectations that they will be anything special. If you have a source for trial plants, let me know.
Jeremy’s advice is good. Having said that I like marion so much and others that I managed to keep mine alive in zone 5b I cover it up completely. Yields are small though.
I also have one in a container I put in the garage with my figs, and that one produces well.
We don’t get hot here. Last year we went over 90 twice. Osage is one I never tried. I have to some time. I too am trying some of my own hybrids. I have no room at present to try new ones.
Tayberry to me is very good and survives here barely. But the fruit is so good, I will always grow it, even with some years having few berries. Canes sometimes die over winter, but never all of them. I have learned to keep them short and crown covered in leaves.
I think Navajo tastes like Triple Crown but is not a crazy fast grower.
I looked up the name, its Orus 4370-1 and it looks like it was recently released, as “Twilight”.
It looks like North American Plants is a wholesale supplier but thats it for now. I didn’t have luck trying to get smaller quantities out of them in the past.
If this berry does well hopefully there will eventually be a source for us small-timers.
I’m not quite sure how any of the Arkansas blackberries should perform in 6B with low temps below zero. Natchez are plenty sweet in in my 7B climate as long as they hang until they easily release from the canes. Very large fruit but the canes are not as vigorous and a lot more trailing than other Arkansas Floricane thornless. Most of the Arkansas blackberries taste similar to me, but offer different disease resistance, ripening times or compressed/long ripening period. Triple Crown here suffers from the heat and SWD. The older USDA blackberry varieties I tested are not as sweet as the plants from Arkansas.
Looks like NAP has a 500 plant minimum order qty…that’s a few more than I need.
I have moved my western trailing plants to pots. I have the following: Marion, tayberry, newberry, boysen, nightfall, and pacific blackberry. Trying to make them more productive and avoid cane borers.
We easily get into the mid-high 90s in the DC ‘burbs, so I might get nada from marionberries, but you all have inspired me to at least try them! Found triple crown no problem, but looks like Indiana Berry is sold out of Osage — advice on other reliable sellers, or should I wait until fall or next spring? I am moving to a new home in September so berry plants bought now will remained potted until fall anyway… I’m just so damn excited to finally get to grow berries again that I can’t stop myself from ordering early.
Thanks for all of your advice!
Jen
Most of the berry retailers stop selling online once it gots really hot because it damages the plants in shipping. If price is not a concern, Burpee has Osage. Their plants are fine.
Pense Berry Farm looks like it’s still selling blackberries, including Osage. You have to buy a minimum of 3, but they’re only $3.50 apiece. But their shipping cost is $20 for any order under $75, over that, it’s free.
Just my second year growing domesticated blackberries, but here is my experience with them. I planted many blackberries last year, including Osage. It had some significant winter dieback here in NE KY, but it was an abnormally cold winter, too. So, it should be okay for you.
My Freedom cane was killed to the ground but has responded well with over a dozen new primocanes this spring. Ouachita, Traveler and Triple Crown had some dieback, but looks like we might get a good harvest this summer. Osage has bloomed, too, just not as much as the others.
I looked at Pense site and now they have upped their minimum shipping order to $150 to get free shipping. If the order is less than that the shipping is $25. I have ordered fruit trees from them a few years ago. I see they have switched to just mainly berries. I was going to order a few berry plants. I have to rethink that with the shipping order being $25.
Yeah, that’s too bad that they upped their minimum price for free shipping. I ordered 4 blackberries from Indiana Berry, and the shipping was only $11. Looks like they have run out of various varieties, like Ponca, Natchez and Kiowa already, tho. Glad I got my order in last month.
Yes. It looks like the supply is limited. I will have to get my order ready to send in earlier next year. One of those things I did not know what varieties to choose. I will look on their site and see if they even have them listed. Even thought they are out I like to read the descriptions of the varieties. Get me ready to choose what I like and get my order ready for the next time. Shipping sounds more reasonable too.
I have a couple Loganberry and love them, but they are quite tart, very flavorful, but very tart… not much sweet at all. If you wait, wait, wait… until they turn deep purple, and are very near going bad… they get a little sweeter… but now if you really like tart and flavor Logans have that.
I love to eat them with other sweeter berries… a couple of blackberries, and a few blueberries is a mouthful of heaven… but if you put a Logan in there with them WOW… takes it up a notch.
About a pint of Llogans in a sauce pan with a few tablespoons of maple syrup, simmered a bit… is OH SO GOOD on French toast.
Here in TN, Zone 7a, my Logans start ripening end of May (very early), a month before my first blackberries are ripe.
I have mine planted in a location where they get morning sun only… and no direct evening sun and they love it, produce like crazy, for near 2 months.
I bought a blackberry plant at Walmart yesterday for $5 called Ebony King. It listed no zone. Info online was conflicting and sketchy. I have plenty of space for experimenting, but wonder if it is worth planting on border of zones 3/4. It sounds like a semi-trailing variety, so I could cover it in winter if it ripens before frost. It also sounded like an older variety, so I am not holding my breath on it being anything great, but for $5 I figured it might be worth the gamble. Walmart had just gotten the bushes in cardboard sleeves in the day before, so they looked healthy. So far only Nelsons have been somewhat successful for me. They have very wicked spines, but that doesn’t deter the deer and rabbits. I had never heard of Ebony King before. Most of the other items in the Walmart rack were common varieties of blueberries, grapes, and raspberries for this area, so that gave me hope these might grow here.
Agreed, but iffy in zone 6. My canes kept dying over winter here in 6a. I now grow wyeberry which is almost exactly the same, except larger and ripens a week earlier. It is slightly hardier than boysenberry, still lose some canes, but more survive than with boysenberry. I pulled boysen out.
