Persimmons 2024

The 4 russian mulberry rootstock I got from BRN looked really good.

Had some big ole roots on them. Looked very fresh. I potted them up in 2.6 gal pots… and waited for them to start pushing shoots and leaves.

3 of them leafed out in just a couple weeks… one (on the right) took a couple weeks longer but did finally leaf out.

I grafted 2 kip parker and 2 lawson dawson.

2 kip parker and 1 lawson dawson have pushed 2 ft of growth now…

That one that leafed out slower than the others pushed buds thru parafilm… and stopped there.

If I had planted it in ground and grafted it next spring… I bet it would have done just fine.

I was wanting at least 1 of each… and got that + an extra kip parker… giving it to my daughter, SIL and grand daughter.

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I grafted mine when some buds barely started to push on the stock (which I rubbed off). No new buds are pushing at all. Scratch test is showing green cambium on stock and scion, they just don’t want to wake up.

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John, if you’re interested in a timber type tree just remind me in the dormant season.
I saved a root sucker off of a tree in my yard that was >3’ in diameter and over 30’ to the first limb. You know, one of those small northern trees everybody talks about.
I always figured it was a male tree, too tall to ever see a bloom. Just a few hard green fruit found on the ground, never a ripe one.
It has not bloomed yet but has a sucker of its own I could separate for you if you’re interested.

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One of the more interesting possibilities with persimmon is of producing clonal rootstock. It looks like a section of root is capable of producing an adventitious shoot.

A major advantage of DV is drought tolerance. DK does not have similar ability.

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I took a peek and sure enough, the graft unions on half of the ones that haven’t budded out yet showed nice callousing. Fortunately I planned to use the BR rootstocks for potted/garage overwintered trees due to the hardiness concerns, so underripe wood that wouldn’t survive the winter two zones south of here should be okay in my garage.

I grafted JT-02/Mikkuso on some rootstock I had growing. How tall do you allow the terminal to grow in the first summer. Grow as a whip or head the terminal to force some side branching? Graft union is healing and I have it loosely staked but does there get to be too much weight at some point on a new graft union? Thanks!

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Two considerations apply. First, how tall do you want the tree to get? Second, how bad are storms in your area? If you want the tree to stop around 15 feet tall, break off the growing tip and force side shoots to grow into 4 new limbs between 4 and 5 feet on the main stem. Why 4 to 5 feet? It will be high enough to avoid deer browse if you have deer problems. I’ve had grafts blown out by storms. From hard experience, I learned to do a better job staking and tying to protect new and easily damaged growth.

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Definitely use that stake to minimize the risk of wind damage to the graft.

A lot depends on deer pressure. Here it is heavy, and the deer do eat persimmon foliage. So my trees are either (1) fenced so that deer can’t reach the trees, or (2) grown so that scaffolds quickly rise above 7’. I assume that you are not going to fence. So that means high scaffolds.

Your existing scaffolds appear too low. You may need to remove them eventually or the deer will. So your question boils down to: What’s the best strategy for developing a tree with a high head / high scaffolds. I agree with the suggestion from @Fusion_power.

Often I would say that you could head the central leader now. But here in Z7A, I have found late-season growth on JT-02 to be sensitive to cold. A cut now would produce incipient scaffolds but they might be killed by winter cold. Also, I find it much easier to produce branching where I want it by waiting until spring, when just about every latent bud wants to grow so you can pick the ones you want and cull the rest.

If it were my tree (and assuming deer pressure), I’d head the scaffolds now to suppress growth then remove them in the winter. Meanwhile I’d leave the central leader to grow and thicken but then head it at 4-5’ (as suggested) during winter. You’d start the spring with a 4-5’ whip, which will sprout lots of potential scaffold shoots.

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Saw you were in Zone6B/7A… Do you (or others) think H63A would be fine in Zone 6A (like it ripens fully and productive)?
I saw Blue Hill Wildlife Nursery has Morris Burton for example as holding onto the fruit on the tree very long and he thinks its more suited South of him when I emailed him to clarify (one of my friend’s farm is an hour north of him that i want to gift an american persimmon tree).

“Morris Burton grows very well here and is very productive. The fruit does not seem to ripen fully and have the flavor it should, and it is best kept in the south. Deer Candy, Deer Luscious, Elmo, Meader, Millers, lots of better ones”

@armyofda12mnkeys

That doesn’t sound like Morris Burton. Could be a labeling mixup. Morris Burton should drop over an extended time starting fairly early but maybe that’s what he is getting at. Morris Burton is also small. Deer Candy is much later for me. Elmo is early. H63A is early too.

Hi Dennis, I have a ton of Rich Tooie seedlings that I’ve grown out thanks to @TNHunter. I have too many to use myself. Can definitely share some with you this winter. They’ll be grafting caliper size, they are in their 2nd year of growth.

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Sigh. Nikita’s Gift living up to its nickname of Nikita’s Drop ( or @mamuang’s Folly). Four dropped this week, leaving 5 on the tree. It sure makes beautiful fruit, but a long way until ripe. I hope a couple hold on…

At least my daughter got to touch it to her tongue for a better understanding of what the word astringent means. Some things are easier to have people experience than to try to explain.

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That is awesome! :slight_smile:

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Well, that really good news, I’ve been searching for ways to obtain some grafting size. I planted about a dozen that Trev sent me last fall, but so far they are not coming up so I would not expect they will until maybe next spring. Are yours grafting size now?
I think I will ultimately have to just remove my chocolate tree as dieback seems to be continuing each week with a new one going bye bye! After several years of good growth its central leader with Jiro failed this week, so I do believe the whole tree is being hit by something that I can’t prune out.
Yes, I definitely would take some if they are more than you need Stan! Even if they need to grow another season to graft that’s better than any other option now!
Actually I would like to actually grow that variety as Trev seems to really like it.
Dennis

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Yes. I grafted H63A (among others) to an established DV tree two years ago. Last year I picked roughly 20 ripe fruits. As I recall they did not ripen all at once. My records seem to indicate that I picked the first on 10/08 and the last roughly 2 weeks later. Keep in mind that this was a first harvest on a young graft. Also the season was a little screwy. It would not surprise me if it ripens a bit earlier this year here.

Another note – I live near the ocean. The water has a cooling effect early in the season. It is often 10 degrees warmer just a few miles inland. So I have a short season compared to other people in Z7A in other inland areas.

But in any case, H63A ripens on the early side. Given the adjustment for an inland location, I think it will ripen for you in Z6A. I’m assuming that you’re not on the coast.

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Keep us posted on how many of the remaining 5 will do. NG was maddening esp. for me since I had no male persimmon.

I’ll certainly keep people updated… hopefully with good news. So far I have cut all the ones that dropped open and don’t see any sign of seeds. All of my Prok and 100-46 have seeds when I harvest them, so I know I have native males in the area although I’m not sure where.

If any make it to maturity it will be interesting to see if there are any seeds. I’m worried a native male persimmon may not be a good pollinator for NG, so hopefully when my Bohzy Dar gets older and can provide pollen it may pollinate them. Or possibly I may need to graft a branch of Chocolate into the tree to try that. Anything to get some fruit from this thing!

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Doubtful they will pollinate it. My Rosseyanka has been seedless with plenty of wild males around. Don’t feel bad, I’ve yet to taste anything from my Nikita’s Drop either and I think mine is older than yours. Grafting most of it over to Journey next year.

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Thank you @Fusion_power and @jrd51 for the suggestions! I don’t have a lot of deer pressure now but they pass through at times and with the added persimmon food source I could see them becoming a problem, so I think I will plan accordingly! I will make sure it is loosely staked to support the new growth. We do get wind and storms. Head the laterals and eliminate those this winter. Head the leader this spring and choose some scaffolds higher up to avoid deer browse. I’m in zone 6b and we have some temperature swings so hoping JT-02 can pull through!

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Yes, many of them are grafting size now. I’ll message you directly about them.

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