Interesting that not everyone considers american persimmon the best rootstock. I’m not saying i agree but i grow both types. Are lotus 60 or 90 chromosome types? Neither? The lotus are used in most cases to graft kaki and kaki hybrids. The rootstock is $5 here Lotus Persimmon Rootstock
" Lotus Persimmon Rootstock
Diospyros lotus seedlings are the most used and adaptable rootstock for persimmons in the US. Also known as Date Plum, they can make tasty small, but astringent fruit. If left ungrafted seedlings will grow out as either male or female plants. Both sexes are needed for pollination and fruit. Can be used as a rootstock for both Asian as well as American persimmon varieties. Fast and easy to grow, they are moderately challenging to get a high percentage of grafts to take. Best to do late when the weather has warmed, or callous grafts on a callousing bench. They are very easy to topwork when 2+" caliper, making growing the rootstocks in place and then grafting over to the desired variety a superior way to go.
Description
Diospyros lotus seedlings are the most used and adaptable rootstock for persimmons in the US. Also known as Date Plum, they can make tasty small, but astringent fruit. If left ungrafted seedlings will grow out as either male or female plants. Both sexes are needed for pollination and fruit. Can be used as a rootstock for both Asian as well as American persimmon varieties. Fast and easy to grow, they are moderately challenging to get a high percentage of grafts to take. Best to do late when the weather has warmed, or callous grafts on a callousing bench. They are very easy to topwork when 2+" caliper, making growing the rootstocks in place and then grafting over to the desired variety a superior way to go."
Most of my kaki are on D. virginiana, but I have one Coffee Cake on D. lotus. I can make a few observations about that one tree: (1) it is relatively runty, (2) it has been almost absurdly precocious, and (3) it leafs out earlier than the kaki on D. virginiana.
Obviously, these three variables are probably not independent; the tree is probably so runty because it was allowed to fruit too early, and because it is more likely to be injured and set back by late frosts. And, in fairness, it is worth noting that it is not my runtiest persimmon — that dishonorable mention goes to a nearby Chocolate on D. virginiana, which has put on less than a foot of growth since 2020, and that I’m keeping around as a sort of curiosity to see if it will ever “leap.”
Notably, adjacent to these two is a Tanenashi on D. virginiana (a not-very-great variety bought before I knew any better) that was planted at the same time and is extremely vigorous — each of its many branches is bigger than either the Chocolate or the Coffee Cake, and it is also very productive. It is about 8’ tall and only that short because of aggressive pruning.
Obviously, with a sample size of 1, I can’t really draw any solid conclusions about lotus vs. native rootstock. But my chief concern in areas like mine that are prone to late frosts is the early leafing. It would make sense to me that D. virginiana would be more conservative and not react as quickly to pump-fake warm spells, as it evolved in and is adapted to the American east coast.
I have also heard (but don’t know whether it is true) that D. virginiana creates a deep taproot and is more drought resistant than D. lotus, which has a shallow fibrous root system.
My lotus rootstocks are about 25 feet tall now. They died back some at first but stopped doing that years ago. Not sure what i’m putting on them yet. May try rosseyanka on one of them.
Lotus isn’t really used much anymore. It was more of a west coast thing and often acted as a dwarfing rootstock. You should get good results from your fully grown ones though. Put two varieties on each.
Lotus is used almost exclusively by Dave Wilson nurseries as persimmon rootstock. Most trees sold on the west coast and possibly beyond are Dave Wilson.
They produce fast growing trees that do not sucker as much as Virginiana.
They are used by Dave Wilson as they are easier to sell bare root. Virginiana is more finicky if roots are disturbed.
I’ve been using lotus as rootstock for Kaki and Virginiana with good results.
I’m looking for hybrid persimmon trees hardy in zone 6 and have found a source of a couple of the cultivars that I want. They are grafted onto D. lotus. Will that make them less cold hardy than those grafted onto D. virginiana?
I don’t know for sure, but I suspect so. I am growing persimmons in Georgia (8A), and I have a Coffee Cake (Nishimura Wase) on lotus (all the rest are on virginiana). It has not gotten cold enough to directly damage the trees in winter, but the lotus rootstock seems to wake up too early, and gets punished every year by the last frost. The natives are more conservative about leafing out, and also grow more vigorously once they do.
Lotus has a shallower root system than virginiana, and that may contribute to susceptibility both to cold damage and to water stress damage. Also, there is some evidence that older persimmons grafted on lotus start to demonstrate a caliper mismatch as the trees become mature.
On the flip side, there is some evidence that lotus may induce earlier fruiting (my Coffee Cake definitely fruited very early and heavily) and it is not prone to suckering, unlike virginiana.
Overall, I think D. virginiana is a superior rootstock in most cases, and definitely if you are zone pushing into a colder area.