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if true that chico was bred from a contorted cultivar, that photo of pumpkin shaped juju indicates a 2-peat :wink:


That’s what I thought…:heart::heart::heart:


shroud it with a net, before a bird or squirrel beats you to the taste-test!


There are three of them. That’s the largest but all that shape. I really don’t have bird or squirrel pressure I guess because of all the cats/dogs but I’ve got grasshoppers big enough to take it home for family dinner. :flushed::flushed:


how old are your contorted seedlings with fruit?


2017 I think. A few bloomed last year and this year. A couple more have fruit but I think it’s all going to stay tiny. This is small but maybe larger as the tree matures??? Can’t wait to taste it.


it should get larger. You can also try taking acouple scionwood from it to graft to vigorous and older rootstock next spring to jumpstart sizing up.

well, me too :wink:


xu zhou, which has been getting some good reviews production-wise.

r4t3 below tends to be longer and more pointy

while ga-866 below tends to be similarly cylindrical but somewhat more tubby


My three most loaded trees





My Lang tree has not one fruit this year except for the grafted limbs on it…I have one fruit of each Black Sea, Coco, R4T3 on branches grafted onto Lang.

Alcalde #1 has NO fruit but has grown about 3 foot.

NO Orange Beauty.

NO Autumn Beauty ( except a few on a graft growing on Li)

Texas Honey (Honey Jar Seedling) has more fruit this year than last year. Not a lot.

Mango Dong Zao (JF&E) has a few fruit

Contorted Seedling in orchard has a few fruit

SiHong seedling has NO fruit (2017)

Li x 2 have fair amount of fruit. Contorted (7ft) has 4 fruit. And Sugar Cane (7ft) has maybe a dozen. Chico has fair amount of fruit…maybe half as many as last year. Redland’s #4 has a few fruit. Honey Jar has MAYBE 1/3 as many fruit as last year.

Can you hear me WHINING???


Nice photos @k8tpayaso! Btw, if fremember it right, alcalde is the same as autumn beauty. Couldnt remember where got that info though


Whining? To some people you are winning!


Oh? I hadn’t heard that. In that vein, though, it is my understanding that Black Sea is the same as Russian #2.

More mysteries.


Alcalde #1 is one of the NM university patented varieties. I was told I could not clone it without permission (fee, that is…)


This is true… be thankful…


Wow, if it really is the same as ogw’s autumn beauty, which was trademarked by ogw, then we have a proprietorship problem here. Who owns what now, really? And have given away autumn beauty scions almost ever year


I don’t think they are the same. The Alcalde is more of just an oblong shape. I haven’t tasted them side by side so can’t attest to that but I had a couple of alcalde last year and I would say they are different ripening times too.


Finally found it, the journal below pertains to alcalde as qiyue xian, which is the non proprietary name for ogw’s autumn beauty if my memory serves me right

The plot thickens lol


Forgot to ask @k8tpayaso, as couldnt see the thorns on the pic of your alcalde. Are they on the long side and tilted forward or distally?


The reason you cannot see the thorns in my picture is because they are almost nonexistent. I hard to look hard to find any.



I won’t be able to say on fruit this year… no alcalde fruit unless it as a late flush. @Bhawkins has both in Dallas.

And here is a quote from your referenced study:

Alcalde #1’, ‘Li’, and ‘Chico’ were thornier than other cultivars,

My trees have had a big growth spurt this year and neither of them have set one fruit. Structure of the trees are very similar.


Autumn Beauty