There is not much known about these type of persimmons and i feel it is important we make a point to know more than we do now.
DEC Wannabe
DEC Double-Ziptie
DEC Goliath
DEC King Crimson
DEC Money Maker – from the breeding work of Donald E. Compton (DEC) in southern Indiana. Excellent fruit.
My friend Chris Homanics says that DEC persimmons are among the very best and highly underrated. I used to have wannabe #2 but it died of unknown causes last winter.
Maybe he’ll join the forum and comment.
Im going to try growing 4 or 5 of them this year. There is nothing i can find documenting anything about them. Hopefully your friend can tell us more.
There are also Brace #1 and #2. I had send Donald a question about his selections, but unfortunately he didn’t read it.
I was told a while back that he is in very poor health.
I hope Chris joins- I’ve seen his name over the years I think in NAFEX discussions. Very knowledgeable.
thats my understanding too. I was told by Buzz that Don is “not a self promoter” and clearly thats the case. He’s been quietly breeding away for decades with little fanfare it seems. My understanding is that others, including Buzz, have come up with many (perhaps all) of these cultivar names. Thus names like the obviously proto-metal prog rock band inspired ‘king crimson’. Don wants his initials attached to the cultivar names, but other than that he doesn’t seem to be after recognition or accolades of any kind. Im excited to try them. Im particularly curious to try the variety given to me as ‘DEC Don’s Earliest’. I wonder how early it really is.
One of these days …
@Lucky_P has done this a long time. Im going to quote him @chills and others from 14 years ago when we were on gardenweb before it sold out.
"Luckyp
14 years ago
Steve,
SFES is mine; suspected to be a polygamodioecious male, but I can never remember to stop by the tree when it’s in bloom. 80% of fruits are small - 1" seedless - 20% are average size for a native, and usually have a single seed.
Typical American persimmon flavor.
Rupp is from Harry Rupp, out of Beaumont, TX. Got mine from B.L. Childers, but it’s not fruited for me - maybe this year; I haven’t looked since bloom period. Fuzzy leaves/stems makes me wonder about its ancestry.
I got Valeene Beauty, Brace #1 & #2 from Don Compton at Marengo, IN. The IN folks I’ve talked to really like VB.
I got ‘Tatum’ from Clifford, but he told me that he didn’t think it was correct.
Raddle - something’s rattling around in the back of my mind, that it’s the same as some other known cultivar - kinda like the Yates/Juhl thing. I just can’t recall what the other, more well-known ID was/is.
Original Author
14 years ago
Hey Lucky,
Very interesting - thanks!
-As for fuzzy leaves/stems (Rupp), I wonder if that’s because its the southern sub-species, or maybe a D. virginiana x D. texana hybrid.
-So, SFES (your selection) was selected because it is a polygamodioecious male, not so much on taste one way or the other? In this case, it would be something along the lines of a Szukis or Claypool F-100, for those interested in a single tree producing both male flowers and female flowers (fruit)?
-I like the Raddle joke - sadly.
-I wonder why England’s Orchard & Nursery carries a “Morris Burton #3” instead of labeling it plainly: “Morris Burton”; your mention of a distinction between Brace #1 & #2 (they have the later) leads me to believe that “Morris Burton” and “Morris Burton #3” are two separate cultivars?
14 years ago
-So, SFES (your selection) was selected because it is a polygamodioecious male, not so much on taste one way or the other? In this case, it would be something along the lines of a Szukis or Claypool F-100?
Yes. I suspect that it’s a fruiting ‘male’, but without viewing the flowers to see if it’s producing both staminate & pistillate - or, possibly, some perfect flowers, I’m just guessing. Flavor is good; I’m not sure I can discern significant flavor differences among the ‘good’ native American persimmons I’ve ever sampled - I’ve tasted some real ‘spitters’, but most good ones are just…good.
Didn’t know if anyone would catch the Raddle/rattle thing, and I didn’t intentionally pun it in there, but noticed it right off, and left it.
Fuzzy Rupp, I’m not sure of its ancestry, and I think I’ve got some other varieties that are sort of fuzzy, too.
14 years ago
I was also looking for a hard to locate persimmon, I-94A from the Claypool breeding program. It is a Lena x Early Golden cross if I remember correctly, and has the overall highest quality rating of all the hybrids and parents in Claypool’s collection. I’m surprised I haven’t seen it offered somewhere. Maybe it was renamed? If anyone out there knows where to find this plant or can offer scion wood, I’d love to grow it.
14 years ago
Mescalito,
I can get back to you regarding I-94A if you leave an email address.
14 years ago
Those cultivars you referenced are on his scion wood list, right?
Personally, I’ve had little luck with grafting (easy stuff, I’ve not tried persimmon) and was wondering if you were aware that you were looking at the scion list. Are persimmons easy (though I thought apples were easy…lol…I’ve had a couple that looked good, but the squirrels don’t seem to want to leave well enough alone)
~Chills
14 years ago
Chills,
Persimmons are right up there with apples/pears(IMO) with regard to ease and success rate - with one caveat: Aftercare is MUCH more critical; you have to check, almost on a daily basis, to keep new shoots from the rootstock below the graft rubbed off - otherwise, they’ll very rapidly overtake the graft, it will decline, and die off. Gotta maintain that diligence for several weeks - and it doesn’t hurt to check 'em at least once a week or so for the entire first growing season.
I’ve done simple whip/splice grafts with good success, but almost exclusively do a simple bark graft(side veneer?) anymore - dormant-collected scionwood - and I prefer a 2 or 3-bud piece - on actively-growing seedling rootstock; I usually try to start grafting persimmons pretty soon after they start leafing out."
I have a DEC Large Morris Burton cross, has anyone had that yet? Mines only 30" tall so mine might take awhile.
Notice in that old thread they mention Claypool
I 94 aka Valeen Beauty which has became very common. Compton persimmons have become more rare.
" An easy to grow American Persimmon with big flavor!
I 94 American Persimmon is also known as Claypool 1-94 or Valeen Beauty. This Large fruit has clear flesh with excellent flavor. Claypool I-94 is large, early, and delicious. It differs from Early Golden by being slightly larger, more oblate and brighter orange color. Another interesting trait of Claypool I-94 is its very large and glossy leaves, making it a beautiful tree year-round."
You may be thinking of the variety’DEC Pink Floyd’, which I hear is good, but not as complex as ‘DEC Yes’ 
@clarkinks
Updates, of sorts.
SFES has been genotyped, and is a 60-chromosome D.v. No evidence of male flowers, ever, on my graft or the one that Jerry Lehman grew out.
A number of persimmons which were grafted onto seedlings in crowded nursery beds… 15-20 years ago… and never got moved to a permanent location… have declined and died out here. One of the Brace trees (IDK which) is still living, as is one I thought was Geneva Red. Others from that GW discussion are either gone, or I can’t ID them.
How crowded? 
My planting could almost be called a test plot but I think it will be fine if I can diligently manage size. I hope.
How crowded?
Envision beds with 20 ft rows of persimmon, pecan, walnut, or oak nuts/seeds planted in double rows, 6 inches apart, with seeds having been planted at 4-6 inch spacings in the row, with maybe 1 ft between the double rows. Then, think about what those might look like 20-25 yrs later if you moved/removed very few of them.
Ok. Sounds like my apple nursery bed that didn’t get moved. I don’t feel so bad about my persimmon rows then! My rows are generally about 12’ apart and within the rows, the spacing is variable, mostly 5-8’ but less in some cases depending on my mood at the time. At my age, I decided it would be easier to thin later rather than plant more later.
I’ve got a few of Compton’s persimmon going here in central MA.
Buzz got me into them last season, he’s all about it.
You get a contact high from his enthusiasm about them.
These are allegedly among his best:
DEC Improved Rosseayanka
DEC Valeene Queen
DEC Wannabe #2
DEC Wannabe #3
DEC Double-Ziptie
DEC Goliath
DEC King Crimson
DEC MoneyMaker
DEC Sugar Hill (Don’s current personal favorite?)
DEC Nikita x Thor F4, F5, F6
DEC Nikita x Thor C5 (male and female flowering)
Basically they’re just getting out to people the past few years, to be evaluated. High hopes for them.
yeah, hard not to “catch a buzz”…
Apart from knowing more about the varieties, which we will soon, it would be interesting to know more about the nature of Mr. Compton’s breeding work, particularly as it relates to Jim Claypool. My understanding is they were peers and that Don was more than a torch bearer for Claypools’s work. ‘Valeen Beauty’ ie I-94 is variously credited to both Claypool and Compton. I know there are some folks on the forum who go pretty far back in their involvement with persimmons, as well as some from the same region as Claypool and Compton. Does anybody have any more info?
I have some (DEC Wannabe #2 x Rosseyanka male) seedlings of 1 yr old to experiment with in Canada.
I will keep everyone informed of the results.